Discussion in 'San Diego Long Range fishing Reports' started by Jim Schmitt, Aug 16, 2017.
iMO for bombs you may need a faster reel.
Both the 25 and 40nld2 will work well with bombs on those rods. Just turn the handle as fast as you can until you get stopped. When in doubt fish bait. Wahoo love sardines too.
Both will work. I would not put more than 65# braid on the 25 so you can keep your inches per crank near maximum. Like a full spool and a short leader of heavy fluoro or wire, whatever your fancy. In the wahoo game it is all about SPEEEEEEED...!!!
Me too, Kevin! Counting the days.
Bill is right on the money here regarding SPEED. Next up in the wahoo experiment is this Mak 30000. 65" per crank, This thing is huge and built like a tank! Next to it is a Stella 10000 with a 20000 spool on it.
Both reels are stuffed to the top with spectra (80# on the 40 and #65 on the 25). I'm a concrete guy by trade and I don't have any problem working hard. If effort is what counts, I intend to be successful. Sounds like the 40 is the better choice of the two. Thanks for the input guys.
People fishing wahoo sometimes wonder why the guy right next to him is getting bit and he isn't using the same jig or bomb....they are cranking as fast as they can turn the handle just as fast as the guy next to him but if your reel only gets 45" per crank and his gets 55" guess what ?? where speed counts you lose...effort counts but IMO speed kills wahoo....just saying.
Speed kills! I think it was Spike who said years ago: "Best color Wahoo jig is fast!"
Fast is always good, indeed you need to balance that with the ability to "turn the handle", which varies greatly from person to person.
The PENN Fathom 40NLDHS at a blazing 60 IPT [7-1 gear ratio] gets bit exceptionally well, but may present a challenge when cranking after bite.
The FTH40NLD2/TRQ40NLD2 [42 IPT] offer what is [for this 63-year old] a nice comfortable balance between bite speed and cranking ability, plus of course the "low" gear if a tuna happens to bite.
From a historic perspective, Carl Newell developed the "wahoo bomb" with Penn YTS conversions [32 IPT]. He created the original 4-1 gear set for 4/0 Senators because he felt he needed just a bit of a bump above the "stock" 26 IPT of the 4/0 Special Senator.
There have been many thousands of wahoo caught with that 32 IPT rate, partially at least because you could crank very hard with it when bit.
I never had a Trinidad 40N, but I have caught many a Hoo on Trinidad 20's with 40# mono and a matching 7" Calstar rod. It's all in the high speed retrieve, high performance drag system, and fishability of that reel IMHO. I'll continue to "go-to" that setup but I will experiment this year with an Accurate Boss 2 speed at least for bait fishing. Also, in my early days, I have caught Hoo's on a Penn Jigmaster. It worked but the drag didn't last more than a couple of fish.
Not really that much finesse with throwing artificial lures to Wahoo, especially bombs. Rarely does is the angler required to throw longer than perhaps about 60 yards as fish are closer to the boat than most folks think... once the chummed bait and or troll fish bring the pack towards the boat. Often times, some boats will actually turn back into the area of the chum line during its slide to stop. This often puts the boat on or near the feeding fish. Watching where the chum is heading after landing in the water can really help in knowing where to toss. On some boats, you may find the bow to be a great spot even for fishing live bait. With my spinners I do not need to use much casting technique as a lob on my various properly matched rod and reels, launches that 5 oz bomb or 125 - 150 Gram Raider plenty far.
I continue to test a variety of manufacturers rods and reels most every year. I find the same rigs I throw most of my Tuna and Yellowtail poppers and surface iron do fine double duty for throwing bombs and Raiders. My reels I use are Stella 18K, Saltist 6500 old version and will be trying a new 6500 version this trip, Shimano Saragossa 25 K, Cabo 100, as well as a Shimano Twin Power 14 K. I mix and match these on a variety of Black Hole Cape cod popping rods, U.C. ,Phenix Hybrid 869Xh and even a heavy Super Seeker 3X spinner I had made for bigger tuna.I also use some hand made bamboo rods from 3 feet to 8 feet long that are the ends of some gaffs provided by the guys on the R,P. several years ago. For bait, I use my Shimano 10K Saragossa spinners, also on a variety of sticks. .
Because most of what we do for fish fighting technique is performed in a more flat rod position, with the rod butt under the arm pit and the tip pointed at the fish, the rod becomes less and less important.. Technique and heavy line is the key for me with the result that most Wahoo are landed in under 30 seconds. Just as importantly, with a variety of spinners, I have an advantage of easy high speed retrieve using 100 pound spectra with a short top shot of 100 pound mono. My drags are between 25 and 30 pounds and my first wind, as I am stepping back, to rip the head of that fish in my direction, with rod flat and smooth power. At that point, again using proper cranking technique and high drags, those skinny buggers cannot get sideways on me and there-for have little ability to do anything other than be pulled straight to the boat. With my elbows kept close and my posture correct I can make a rather compact and efficient cranking machine even with those high speed spinners.. I can do the same exact thing with conventional reels. There is very little if any slippage of the drag due to the high drag setting and heavy gauge line.
Folks who have watched my technique on the boats tend to switch over from their typical bent rod methodologies as I seem to get more than my share of Wahoo. Just as importantly, I really do not get too tired even when landing dozens in a day.
Now, with that said, I have a great angler friend Steve M. who goes on one of my charters every year, who uses a Tranx High speed and a Phenix Hybrid 809Xh. He and I go head to head on a regular basis to see who is high stick. The results are always close and are usually tops on the boat. I also really, really love the United Composites XP70 HP along with the PHD Phenix for this application as it doubles up beautifully for tuna with more backbone for heavier jigs than the standard Phenix Black Diamond lineup (Still great rods for the 30 - 50# work). As you can see, there are many ways to skin a wahoo cat.. As many of the folks on this thread have stated, speed kills wahoo on the retrieve.
Bait fish is simple. Use a 30 or 40 pound rig that can easily lob or cast a wired bait rig into the zone with the least amount of impact on the bait. Again, I flat rod the rig though I cannot rip the head off the fish due to the lighter line. In the case of bait and wire leader, I use lighter than normal drags as these things tend to magnify the amount of pressure put on connections and they tend to find ways to part. I fish a few pounds lighter than normal when fishing Wahoo on bait... Which these days I only do for fun on the bamboo rods and also a toy like Ice fishing rod with 10 pound test.
Jim, Don't over think this wahoo game as most any of your rated 30 - 80 pound casting sticks will work (30 and 40 for bait). What ever reel you buy it is incumbent to attempt to wind at a pace roughly equal to the guys that have faster gears on their reels and are pulling those lures at a high rate of speed thru the water , especially when fishing those great Captain Jimmy Bombs that many of us love. However, on lighter tipped sticks where the angler actually uses a full casting motion, throwing the bomb will feel like they are going to snap the tip as the tip is over loaded. Thus, the reason most folks like a stiffer tip for that application
For those with smaller hands, a 500 size reel works great for bombs and even a 400 size for bait... You just have to turn the handle faster than I do which might cause you to wear out faster when fishing the artificial lures. Most of my spinners are 50+ inches of retrieved line per crank which allows me to crank fast but not overly fast as most folks have to do on their conventional reels with less line retrieve. My slower spinners I can use for bait on most all species as well as Wahoo. If you are going to fish artificial lures all day, having a rig that seem to fit your hand and fingers as well as balances well will certainly help you enjoy the often times very long days of stopping and casting.
If you have any other questions please feel free to pm me.
Thanks as always for your detailed descriptions Jamie! I haven't been fishing with you for years but need to make it down to Bob Sands before my October trip and hopefully whitness a demo of your technique.
I love fishing wahoo with Jamie. We are a team and work together to figure out what and how they want it. I have two of the Tranx HG Phenix 809XH setups and IMO for a conventional setup nothing can top it. The key is to keep casting and never give up, especially when they are pressured. You never know what stop will produce. Jamie can attest for this on our trip last year. He and I never gave up unlike others and on one stop it was a hookup on every cast. It didn't last long and the ones who were scrambling to gear up, lost out.
Stick a drill on the crank, you can get the speed you need...
On my last 8 day we put a clinic on the wahoo
My go to wahoo bomb was the KK Pono in green 9oz super seeker 70H Trinidad 40N
Got bit every slide
Bait was a super seeker 70 talica 8ii with 30lb knot 2 kinky wire
Just keep cranking thru the bite and before you realized that wahoo is done
Here's hoping this years trip is 1/2 as good as last years. Ive been making up some heavier bombs to sink out deeper on the slide for trip 31. Can't wait !!
Unfortunately when I went to sign up it was sold out. I guess the word got out on that trip.
Oh well I'll read your guys posts and hope you guys slay them
Great group of guys on that trip
Bummer you won't be on this trip Jer, the counts will be lower for sure.
Avet Raptors for me, 33% drag, Hx 50# iron, Jx 40# bait. I get more than my share. Graf 770H and PHD-700X2H
Dont forget to drop the unbit marauder back on troll stops. i got so many this way on one trip they called me 'drop back'
What line do you use and what top shot?
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