Rockfish and short fish in Mexico answers

portaslayer

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Jul 24, 2009
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Eddy
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portaboat, 12 ft, ss boat
I heard there are different limits as far as quanities in mex too. For instance is it true you can take 5 dorado there but only two here? If so, how does this rule effect that?
 

the hook

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Jul 8, 2003
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I heard there are different limits as far as quanities in mex too. For instance is it true you can take 5 dorado there but only two here? If so, how does this rule effect that?
You have it backwards.- sort of. 2 dodos in Mex.
I think it is 10 here.
 

16glaspar

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Nov 15, 2008
37
48
Lemon grove ca
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Rick
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16' Glaspar Citation
Anyone have any experience with DFG siezing fish caught in Mex for not having a Declaration form? I did send one to DFG in Sac the next day. I was also informed fishing in the US and in Mex on the same day is considered double dipping...Right!!! I informed DFG that means I was fishing in the US and Mex at the same time...DFG took some of my fish and ticked me for not having a declaration form... I go to court in Nov. I'm screwed...Please advise.
 

crazy hawaiian

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Anyone have any experience with DFG siezing fish caught in Mex for not having a Declaration form? I did send one to DFG in Sac the next day. I was also informed fishing in the US and in Mex on the same day is considered double dipping...Right!!! I informed DFG that means I was fishing in the US and Mex at the same time...DFG took some of my fish and ticked me for not having a declaration form... I go to court in Nov. I'm screwed...Please advise.
Never received a ticket, but have been warned a couple times about not having one filled in completely before entering U.S. waters.

Regarding "double dipping", the warden you quoted said that fishing in US and Mexico on the same day is illegal, not sure about the comment "considered it double dipping, but having fought the good fight with the DFG over a long period over that same issue I have come to understand their position.

I use to fish Mexico a lot during the closed rockfish season here, and would stop at the jetty to drift for halibut at the end of the day.

If a warden checked me on the water he could question if in fact the rockcod I had were not caught at the jetty, and not as I claimed while holding a declaration form in my hand. He did not see me catch the rockfish, but he did see me fishing therefore it's more than just my word against his.

If on the other hand he checked me on the water while on my way back to the dock, my filled out declaration form, and my word that the rockfish were caught in Mexico is good enough for him.

I'd rather have that tradeoff over having to take a lie detector test everytime I return from Mexico.

BTW: Now if I want to make a few drifts for halibut after a day of fishing Mexico we simply drive to the launch ramp, put our fish, filleted inside the bay, not in Mexico which is illegal, in a ice chest in our tow vehicle, then run back out to our favorite halibut spot. Total time under 15 minutes.

And also have a declaration form completely filled out before entering US waters, and am always thankful that we still have the option of fishing in Mexico.

Hope they don't lean on you too hard. You might even point out to the judge that even the DFG agents are not clear on the statutes.

It tooks me months to get a clear answer on the issue. There's an article by the editor of Pacific Coast Sportfishing magazine about the phone conversation we had. It was in 2003 I believe. If I find my copy I will PM you the date. It covers the long process I went through to get my question regarding fishing in both countries on the same day, and all the confusion among DFG agents on the matter.

When I was told by an agent it was illegal I asked them to point out the specific regulations covering it, not one could do so!

Sorry for the long read.
 

Alan

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Dec 15, 2003
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At the end of the day it is completely up to the warden. If they want to write a ticket they can. BS and stupid.
 

bluewaterbum

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Jul 16, 2012
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John you made this statement in your first post (see below) but I don't know how old you are but the restriction on BSB has been around since the 1980's and it would seem by know the BSB population would have recovered to be fished again, but as usual when the government makes a temporary rule or law they become permanent. Just as the rules for Cowcod and other fish on the no keep rule now will never be removed. Same goes for the depths people can fish they just might not stay at 120' in some areas or 300' in others because the DFG is being controlled by environmentalists at this time.

These groups seem to love it when they get people like you and others to make statements like you did below to further their cause at the DFG. Before you make these statements you should look up what the DFG has not been doing, like backing up their rules with science or even doing studies to see if the rules made now or before could be less restricted.

There is a Black Seabass section too in the reg book (section 28.10, page 41 in the 2008 DFG reg book) that allows you to take up to two Black Seabass in Mexico and bring them back into California provided you have a declaration and a Mexican fishing license. Although this is a cool exception, I think anyone who takes these beautiful fish or any other short fish no matter where they are at should have their boat sunk and rods snapped. There is no excuse for that in my book.
 

StuBro

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Jul 22, 2012
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Greg
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29' Blackfin Flybridge "Reel Living"
Avoiding this hassle at the ramps is "almost" worth my slip fee.

Anyone been stopped by the "mussel" police yet in the freshwater lakes? I see bird shit on your boat seat. It may contain some sort of banned mussel larvae or however they grow. I ask, "Don't you think the birds shit in the lake too? What the fuck is wrong with you?"

Common sense is dead.
 

badfish34

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May 29, 2007
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Those were my intentions Sir. I like big women too.LOL Hypothetically if you screw a Fat Whore in TJ does it count in CA.?
it only counts if you fill out a declaration form before crossing the border
 

MikeyLikesIt

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Yeah I have a law background too, and the original post is 100% wrong.
Um, yeah. We have been stopped and checked at the ramp with "short" lingcod...caught in Mexico.....showed them our declaration forms, and were told to have a nice day.

Your mileage may vary, and buyer beware. :D
 

Ocean-tendency

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Simple solution, you can catch undersized fish in MX, however assume the risk of the DFG agent or whatever they're called nowadays, and IF you are going to do that then do the Following: 1) fill out Declaration form, 2) pic of fish with Mx in background on your phone, in other words quality doesn't matter, just proof, but also noting the time and date off a watch or GPS unit helps too. 3) Make sure you have all legal licenses for both waters including your passport in the same spot with Declaration Document. You have proof beyond a reasonable doubt that you did what you are suppose to do, so if the guy wants to be a dick, you got proof he screwed up. OR just keep size limits that same as CA and still follow the rest of the guidelines. The more you have to prove your case with less "Talk" to the officer the better, if you got that indication he's gonna be a DB, quietly pull out your phone or GoPro and start recording, then the warden will say "Excuse me sir but why are you recording this conversation," you answer well officer, why are you not observing the correct procedures that I have followed and showed you proving that I fished properly under both MX and CA regulation codes, am I being detained..ok thanks now have a great day" and leave. The Warden knows you did everything you were suppose to do and if he persues you, then you have on video of harrassment because if you've come to the conclusion he has nothing to go on, he can't detain you by law without a warrant, even more so, they do not have permission by law to come on board of your vessel without your permission, notice why they always ask for permission or may I see your license please...But don't be a dick, let them be a dick, you got it on video, which holds up more in court than what they can argue or try to argue.
 

Ocean-tendency

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oh and if you do roll out, make sure on the video you see all your documentation and he acknowledges no wrongdoing before bailing out.
 

Rabid Fish

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Jun 27, 2004
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Simple solution, you can catch undersized fish in MX, however assume the risk of the DFG agent or whatever they're called nowadays, and IF you are going to do that then do the Following: 1) fill out Declaration form, 2) pic of fish with Mx in background on your phone, in other words quality doesn't matter, just proof, but also noting the time and date off a watch or GPS unit helps too. 3) Make sure you have all legal licenses for both waters including your passport in the same spot with Declaration Document. You have proof beyond a reasonable doubt that you did what you are suppose to do, so if the guy wants to be a dick, you got proof he screwed up. OR just keep size limits that same as CA and still follow the rest of the guidelines. The more you have to prove your case with less "Talk" to the officer the better, if you got that indication he's gonna be a DB, quietly pull out your phone or GoPro and start recording, then the warden will say "Excuse me sir but why are you recording this conversation," you answer well officer, why are you not observing the correct procedures that I have followed and showed you proving that I fished properly under both MX and CA regulation codes, am I being detained..ok thanks now have a great day" and leave. The Warden knows you did everything you were suppose to do and if he persues you, then you have on video of harrassment because if you've come to the conclusion he has nothing to go on, he can't detain you by law without a warrant, even more so, they do not have permission by law to come on board of your vessel without your permission, notice why they always ask for permission or may I see your license please...But don't be a dick, let them be a dick, you got it on video, which holds up more in court than what they can argue or try to argue.
I think having those pictures can't hurt, but just so you and everyone else knows, DFG isn't bound by the same 4th Amendment restrictions as regular cops are. A regular cop can't come into your house without permission or a warrant, or search you without permission or a warrant (assuming you're not on probation or anything), but a DFG officer CAN search your boat and your belongings without your permission BUT this is limited to situations where the officer reasonably believes you were engaging in fishing activities, and I'm pretty sure he can only search for evidence of fish and game related violations.

So if a DFG boat pulls up to your boat and you've got illegal fish in your cooler, you can't just refuse to be searched and go on your merry way. They can search you and they will bust you. Likewise, if you're a diver and you're standing next to your car in a wetsuit, they can search you, your car and your belongings because they have reason to believe you've been engaged in fishing activities.

But they can't set up a checkpoint and search every random car for fish & game violations. They have to have some way of knowing or reasonably believing the people in the each car has been fishing or hunting.
 

Ocean-tendency

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Got news for ya, you can even get Roo at Trader Joe's or Sprouts from time to time..F'in love KangaFinroo, soo lean and clean...hhmm Mexican grouper is really tasty too, had a friend slip me a couple fillets of some Black...so dang good, but I'm def not gonna go F up my buds boat, destroying anyone's property just because you have a rod up your ass of your opinion just means you're a dick. Just because people take sharks, which I don't like for myself, but as long as it's done in an ethical way and no meat is wasted, then that is your deal. Now short fish pisses me off, but once again destroying or threatening people, makes you sound like lil Napoleontitis boy. LEAD by example, but violence really solves, what?? That person will still be a dick after you give a beat down.
 
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Paul Ward

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Jul 17, 2007
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wooddog
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Boaty
Thanks JRefkin for clarifying new regs for all BDCKRS!
Last year we were cited under the same code (but different charge from short imported fish) after a days fishing in Mexico.
I poured over the regs, spoke with the DFG and eventually charges were dropped.
They need to make the regs as clear and unambiguous as you have.
If not, they are simply revenue collectors and not conservationists etc.
its fund raising not law enforcement , they should have a bake sale lol
 

bluewaterbum

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Jul 16, 2012
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</PRE></P>
Hey guys, I've been reading the posts about Rockfish fishing down in <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com
DFG does not enforce Mexican regulations, per say. Instead, they enforce <st1:State><st1:place>California</st1:place></st1:State>'s importation laws. When we fish down in <st1:country-region><st1:place>Mexico</st1:place></st1:country-region> and bring the fish back to <st1:City><st1:place>San Diego</st1:place></st1:City>, we are importing into <st1:State><st1:place>California</st1:place></st1:State>. There was a change in the law last year, Fish and Game Code section 2353- it says: <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = " border=" /><o:p></o:p>

(a) Birds, mammals, fish, reptiles, or amphibians shall not
be imported or possessed in this state unless all of the following
requirements are met:
(1) The animals were legally taken and legally possessed outside
of this state.
(2) This code and regulations adopted pursuant thereto do not
expressly prohibit their possession in this state.
(3) A declaration is submitted to the department or a designated
state or federal agency at or immediately before the time of entry,
in the form and manner prescribed by the department.


This basically says that anything that is illegal to possess in <st1:State><st1:place>California</st1:place></st1:State>, is illegal to import. The Lt said short fish falls under that category. You can take short fish in <st1:country-region><st1:place>Mexico</st1:place></st1:country-region>, but you can't possess them in <st1:State><st1:place>California</st1:place></st1:State>- so don't bring em back. You also canâ&#8364;&#8482;t possess illegal fillets in <st1:State><st1:place>California</st1:place></st1:State>. So make sure your bass and Halibut fillets are the legal size.

The Lt. said there is an exception to the rockfish closure. California Code of Regulations, Title 14 section 27.51(b)- this regulation allows rockfish to be taken in open areas and transported back through closed areas aboard vessels in transit with no fishing gear in the water. This means if you catch rockfish in Mex and want to bring back to <st1:State><st1:place>California</st1:place></st1:State>, you can't stop and fish in US waters or stop and fish off IB or in SD Bay, etc. The Lt. said the exception is Cowcod, Yelloweye, and Canary Rockfish. These species can't be possessed year round in <st1:State><st1:place>California</st1:place></st1:State>, so they cannot be imported into <st1:State><st1:place>California</st1:place></st1:State> from <st1:country-region><st1:place>Mexico</st1:place></st1:country-region>.

There is a Black Seabass section too in the reg book (section 28.10, page 41 in the 2008 DFG reg book) that allows you to take up to two Black Seabass in <st1:country-region><st1:place>Mexico</st1:place></st1:country-region> and bring them back into <st1:State><st1:place>California</st1:place></st1:State> provided you have a declaration and a Mexican fishing license. Although this is a cool exception, I think anyone who takes these beautiful fish or any other short fish no matter where they are at should have their boat sunk and rods snapped. There is no excuse for that in my book.

So, long story short, you can't bring in short fish from <st1:country-region><st1:place>Mexico</st1:place></st1:country-region>. You can fish for Rockfish in Mexcio during the <st1:State><st1:place>California</st1:place></st1:State> closure and bring them back provided you don't stop to fish in the <st1:country-region><st1:place>US</st1:place></st1:country-region> on the way back, but don't take any Cowcod, Yelloweye, or Canary Rockfish. Hope that helps. Look up the sections if you want to see for yourself.

John Refkin
 

bluewaterbum

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Jul 16, 2012
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Well not unless you want all your rods snapped and your boat sunk, for keeping one of these beautiful fish.
Just because you rhink something is beautiful doesn’t mean I or others think the same way.
If it’s legal to catch and keep and I catch one for food, that’s my business not yours or anyone else’s.
My god, by now there should be enough BSB to open up the fishery, but without the government doing a real check it and other fisheries will stay closed forever.