Pink Fluoro

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Abaco

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There's a lot of knowledge here on this. You guys are all smarter than you look.
 
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Bill W

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  • Jan 12, 2006
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    Yep last few years I have used mono 80% of the time……mostly Momoi Hi Catch Smoke Blue and Soft Steel Ultra clear…..seems to catch fish just fine.

    Was wondering when you changed over what you were using before.

    I am considering using soft steel also, but might try a short piece of fluro for abrasion. Thanks David..
     
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    Fishybuzz

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    I was using Seaguar Premier and Seaguar Blue for cows…..and for smaller fish Yo Zuri Pink FC and Ande FC…..

    I don't like having a additional knot knot in the mix so I don't like putting a FC leader on the mono…..so I run straight mono...
     
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    Smudge

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    Bill W said:
    I am guessing manufactured flurocarbon is not surface dye. There is a good reason for that...

    Since we're guessing, I'll wait for a manufacturer to come back on that one.

    Even fluoro absorbs water and hence the Rit dye. It doesn't rub off. And I use fluoro for superior abbrasion resistance for a whole different reason than you guys. I was just passing on that getting pink fluoro is much easier than you all think it is... But if you want, I'll dye up some batches for you and sell it back to you at an additional 50% :D

    Carl said:
    If you dye your line, you would negate the translucent quality of it.
    pretty much the reason guys pay $82375857 per ' for it is its 'invisibilty'.
    If abrasion is your determining factor you could just go with heavier mono.
    Dye = bad imo.
    It's not my fault they want pink fluoro
     
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    Abaco

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    Interesting. I also started shying away from having the mono/fluoro splice knot so started using just about 25' of fluoro at the beginning of each day. We all have our flavor of the day, I guess.
     
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    Steve K

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    "Fish it by diameter instead of listed rating"

    We should all be doing that. Then, there are those times when you can't even rely on that. The recent examples of Basil and Chris filling reels with Seaguar Threadlock, larger listed diameter than JB Hollow, but they got more Threadlock on a reel than JB. Go figure, we're somewhat afflicted with analysis paralysis.

    When I grow up, I want to be like Bob Michener!
     
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    JohnTFT

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    The only way to fish fluorocarbon is by diameter. If you are looking for higher abrasion resistance larger diameter lines offer that. Different presentation smaller diameters.

    When purchasing fluorocarbon in bulk coils there are no markings on the package other than diameters. I am ridiculed by some because I bring a waterproof digital vernier with me when I go fishing. Just easier to measure some line to select the correct crimp. Organization can become less than optimal as the trip goes on. Lines could be put in the wrong package. Just measure it!

    As far as the measurement of spectra that is another topic altogether. So many different measurements by all of the manufacturers and "independent" analysts.
     
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    hydro

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    The only way to fish fluorocarbon is by diameter. If you are looking for higher abrasion resistance larger diameter lines offer that. Different presentation smaller diameters.

    When purchasing fluorocarbon in bulk coils there are no markings on the package other than diameters. I am ridiculed by some because I bring a waterproof digital vernier with me when I go fishing. Just easier to measure some line to select the correct crimp. Organization can become less than optimal as the trip goes on. Lines could be put in the wrong package. Just measure it!

    As far as the measurement of spectra that is another topic altogether. So many different measurements by all of the manufacturers and "independent" analysts.

    The discussion of fishing flourocarbon by diameter is very interesting to me. My comments are directed at cow fishing as cow trips are the only trips I do. I have only been on two 14-day trips so my experience is limited. When fishing sardines I have been using either 100# or 130# flouro with the general "rule" of fishing the 130# whenever possible (i.e when it will get bit). I have been using Seaguar Premier exclusively and on my last trip was chewed off twice on 100# (with a circle hook). This has me re-thinking my choice of leader material, not just necessarily brand but also size. I have heard that some folks fish 130# premier as if it was 100# and use 150# as if it was 130# because of its thin diameter.

    How do you guys fish flourocarbon by diameter? Is there a benchmark diameter for 100# and 130#? Is there a minimum/maximum size you guys go by? I'm looking for information on how you select leader material and the thought process behind it.
     
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    dh515

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    The discussion of fishing flourocarbon by diameter is very interesting to me. My comments are directed at cow fishing as cow trips are the only trips I do. I have only been on two 14-day trips so my experience is limited. When fishing sardines I have been using either 100# or 130# flouro with the general "rule" of fishing the 130# whenever possible (i.e when it will get bit). I have been using Seaguar Premier exclusively and on my last trip was chewed off twice on 100# (with a circle hook). This has me re-thinking my choice of leader material, not just necessarily brand but also size. I have heard that some folks fish 130# premier as if it was 100# and use 150# as if it was 130# because of its thin diameter.

    How do you guys fish flourocarbon by diameter? Is there a benchmark diameter for 100# and 130#? Is there a minimum/maximum size you guys go by? I'm looking for information on how you select leader material and the thought process behind it.

    What I do is use Seaguar Premier as a baseline since it supposedly is an IGFA rated line. Has worked out ok for me so far.
     
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    Fishybuzz

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    The discussion of fishing flourocarbon by diameter is very interesting to me. My comments are directed at cow fishing as cow trips are the only trips I do. I have only been on two 14-day trips so my experience is limited. When fishing sardines I have been using either 100# or 130# flouro with the general "rule" of fishing the 130# whenever possible (i.e when it will get bit). I have been using Seaguar Premier exclusively and on my last trip was chewed off twice on 100# (with a circle hook). This has me re-thinking my choice of leader material, not just necessarily brand but also size. I have heard that some folks fish 130# premier as if it was 100# and use 150# as if it was 130# because of its thin diameter.

    How do you guys fish flourocarbon by diameter? Is there a benchmark diameter for 100# and 130#? Is there a minimum/maximum size you guys go by? I'm looking for information on how you select leader material and the thought process behind it.



    getting chewed off is mainly issue of where the hook set is……if in the corner of the mouth chew offs the chances are decreased….if the fish is hooked somewhere in the mouth other than the corner or deep chances of chew offs are greatly increased….IMO choice of hooks and hook setting technique will influence where the hook will set in the fish…..So it is not just the choice of line that is causing chew offs.
     
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    Mr GreenJeans

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    How do you guys fish flourocarbon by diameter? Is there a benchmark diameter for 100# and 130#? Is there a minimum/maximum size you guys go by? I'm looking for information on how you select leader material and the thought process behind it.

    Personally, I use Seaguar Blue as my approximate benchmark. Below is information from the Melton website. I round these values to 0.9 mm for 90#, 1.0 mm for 100#, and 1.2 mm for 130#. Obviously, this is little more than personal preference, but when comparing diameters across brands, those are the benchmarks I apply.

    Seaguar Blue Label Fluorocarbon Leader - 30M Spools
    SKUPound TestDiameterPRICEQTY
    83840390 lb..910mm$74.99
    838385100 lb.1.04mm$84.99
    838404130 lb.1.17mm$79.99
    838402150 lb.1.28mm$84.99
    838405180 lb.1.38mm$84.99
    838406200 lb.1.57mm$86.99
     
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    ifish42na

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    Seaguar Threadlock, larger listed diameter than JB Hollow

    JB published diameters are not correct, read the caveats.

    Manufacturer's published diameters. Actual diameters may vary.

     
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    okie man

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    a smart angler will choose his line dia/color by conditions. flat calm, not a cloud in the sky type conditions, better do every thing you can to reduce the visibility of your leader. got some wind, little chop, cloudy, dusk or dawn, step up the size of it. seldom do the great ones say " all I fish is". if one wants to see how a fish see's your line , grab a mask and jump into a pool with some different lines laying across the pool at different depths. it is, eye opening!
     
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    JohnTFT

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    My thought process for selecting leaders of all types is simple: Larger diameter more abrasion resistance. Smaller diameter less abrasion resistance. I get bit fine on both. I use Premier a great deal because of its stretch characteristics. But, I have caught some really good fish recently on Berkley Pro Spec which is larger in diameter. With Premier you can step up the line class since the diameters are so different. I use 170 Premier since it is the same diameter as 150 Blue Label.

    Wide open bite fish the biggest diameter possible. Scratch fishing go smaller. At the end of the day we are splitting hairs.

    I think many times chew offs may not actually be from teeth. If you examine a fish after you catch it, look at the abrasion lines along the body of the fish. Gill plates, Finlets, and the entire tail section are very hard and can do great damage to fishing lines.

    So you can abrade the line in many ways other than teeth.
     
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    finishright

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    Dave take some of both and give it a shot I have both the lighter yozuri I have had good luck with and have for many years Just a note if it's wide open bite after this you still won't know!! have fun
     
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    dh515

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  • Sep 18, 2004
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    I think many times chew offs may not actually be from teeth. If you examine a fish after you catch it, look at the abrasion lines along the body of the fish. Gill plates, Finlets, and the entire tail section are very hard and can do great damage to fishing lines.

    So you can abrade the line in many ways other than teeth.

    Good point. I took this pic because i liked the color of this fish but look at the line marks on the gill plate, body and tail.
    image.jpg


    But then again, don't think these are gonna do your line any favors either. (Close up YFT teeth)
    image.jpg
     
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    ReelDealAngler

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    Hook set position definitely makes a difference when it comes to line abrasion (corner of the mouth with a ringed hook seriously increases your odds of success in my book), ringed hooks do make a difference IMO as you have a metal to metal connection that swivels MUCH better with less harmful friction than a flouro/mono knot tied directly to a metal hook eye does, rings truly provide an advantage when a strong or mean "devil" fish suddenly changes direction (line angle) on you or when fight time gets extended. Fight time is an important factor that often gets overlooked when discussing line abrasion and overall wear and tear on your terminal... in my mind, the shorter the fight time the better your chances are of hearing that hooked fish's tail beating on the deck, especially when fishing tuna in the larger grade (a "green" fish with a fast and heavy tail slap after it hits the deck generally means you did good).

    Sound terminal connections with a smooth/well maintained reel drag combined with higher drag settings, as well as solid fighting technique: a balanced stance with smooth and steady pressure applied... so you are fighting the fish rather than your gear or your own body using line angles that are in your favor rather than the fish's favor is what matters most on the fighting end when you get right down to it. OK, so it never hurts to be lucky too ;).

    Tight lines and blue skies!
     
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    sk8ingtuna

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    getting chewed off is mainly issue of where the hook set is……if in the corner of the mouth chew offs the chances are decreased….if the fish is hooked somewhere in the mouth other than the corner or deep chances of chew offs are greatly increased….IMO choice of hooks and hook setting technique will influence where the hook will set in the fish…..So it is not just the choice of line that is causing chew offs.


    Oh, yeah, that's right, I've never seen one roll over, then a whole bunch of line is grating on their teeth. Not to mention the other abrasion areas DH515 pointed out.

    Oh, wait, I have seen them roll over, often.

    My vote is straight fluoro, or at least a fluoro leader ala Bob Michener.
     
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    $norkle

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    There's two parallel threads running here: fish vision and fluorocarbon diameter. I rely on all you guys for expertise on the specs of the material, but here's some info on fish vision. Cones are for "daylight vision", including color vision if the species has visual pigments that allow it. Rods are for "night-time vision" or more accurately stated, low-light vision. Cones can transmit directly to the visual cortex singly (sp?) or in groups called retinal units. Rods are always in groups, and that is what leads to greater sensitivity at any level of light, and also greater sensitivity to movement. (explaining that is a long discussion not needed here) What is most important to the discussion on color is that a fish is limited in color vision by the visual pigments that it has in the cones. In fishes like skipjack, there is only a single visual pigment that is matched precisely to the color of downwelling light. So a skipjack "sees" by looking upward and forward, and by silhouetting prey against a lighter background. In a sense, it sees prey by not seeing it, but rather a silhouette of it---just as accurate, but not as colorful. That same skipjack also has the fovea in the lower rear quadrant of the retina (unlike directly in the back like in humans) so that the greatest acuity is in this upward-forward direction. It's probably like this in most pelagics that strike upward. Most important in this whole discussion is that it is likely that most of these fish don't see color.

    In contrast, dorado have multiple visual pigments and probably see color pretty well, and more than likely yellowtail do as well. So then you're left with having to decide which fish might be more easily fooled by pink vs. clear. I don't have those answers, but I continue to have success with both pink and clear fluorocarbon.

    As an aside, YFT have an olfactory sensitivity for fish odor that's been measured to 10 to the minus 16 (0.0000000000000001).
    That would seem to indicate that they locate prey from longer distances by smell, and only rely on vision in the final rush to the prey at close range.
     
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    Bill W

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    Where we see all light, tuna have the ability to distinguish polarized light. In the morning and evening polarized light is the greatest. So tuna feed at these times. This sensitivity gives vision to tuna up to 3 times the distance that would be normal vision. Kinda like the prey is lite up like a neon sign.

    As far as red vision, tuna do not see red because the water environment filters out that color. The tuna eye is colorblind to that color by nature.

    My take is fishing line is a transmitter of polarized light. Since fish do not see red, and red is filtered very shallow, the line is camouflaged to some degree.

    I learned a lot from this post and hope to put it to use in the future...

    Here is a link...

    http://midcurrent.com/science/fish-eyesight-does-color-matter/
     
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    Fishybuzz

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    There's two parallel threads running here: fish vision and fluorocarbon diameter. I rely on all you guys for expertise on the specs of the material, but here's some info on fish vision. Cones are for "daylight vision", including color vision if the species has visual pigments that allow it. Rods are for "night-time vision" or more accurately stated, low-light vision. Cones can transmit directly to the visual cortex singly (sp?) or in groups called retinal units. Rods are always in groups, and that is what leads to greater sensitivity at any level of light, and also greater sensitivity to movement. (explaining that is a long discussion not needed here) What is most important to the discussion on color is that a fish is limited in color vision by the visual pigments that it has in the cones. In fishes like skipjack, there is only a single visual pigment that is matched precisely to the color of downwelling light. So a skipjack "sees" by looking upward and forward, and by silhouetting prey against a lighter background. In a sense, it sees prey by not seeing it, but rather a silhouette of it---just as accurate, but not as colorful. That same skipjack also has the fovea in the lower rear quadrant of the retina (unlike directly in the back like in humans) so that the greatest acuity is in this upward-forward direction. It's probably like this in most pelagics that strike upward. Most important in this whole discussion is that it is likely that most of these fish don't see color.

    In contrast, dorado have multiple visual pigments and probably see color pretty well, and more than likely yellowtail do as well. So then you're left with having to decide which fish might be more easily fooled by pink vs. clear. I don't have those answers, but I continue to have success with both pink and clear fluorocarbon.

    As an aside, YFT have an olfactory sensitivity for fish odor that's been measured to 10 to the minus 16 (0.0000000000000001).
    That would seem to indicate that they locate prey from longer distances by smell, and only rely on vision in the final rush to the prey at close range.



    Thanks Bruce….great info……

    so when you hook a tuna in the dark at 150 feet does the tuna find your sardine/squid by vibration and smell ?????
     
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    Bill W

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    Thanks Bruce….great info……

    so when you hook a tuna in the dark at 150 feet does the tuna find your sardine/squid by vibration and smell ?????

    Tuna swim normally just above the thermocline. (Around that depth) So what sense do tuna use when we are trolling. Although jigs at night may make vibrations my guess is sight takes over when they bite the jig.
     
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    Wildman

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    There's two parallel threads running here: fish vision and fluorocarbon diameter. I rely on all you guys for expertise on the specs of the material, but here's some info on fish vision. Cones are for "daylight vision", including color vision if the species has visual pigments that allow it. Rods are for "night-time vision" or more accurately stated, low-light vision. Cones can transmit directly to the visual cortex singly (sp?) or in groups called retinal units. Rods are always in groups, and that is what leads to greater sensitivity at any level of light, and also greater sensitivity to movement. (explaining that is a long discussion not needed here) What is most important to the discussion on color is that a fish is limited in color vision by the visual pigments that it has in the cones. In fishes like skipjack, there is only a single visual pigment that is matched precisely to the color of downwelling light. So a skipjack "sees" by looking upward and forward, and by silhouetting prey against a lighter background. In a sense, it sees prey by not seeing it, but rather a silhouette of it---just as accurate, but not as colorful. That same skipjack also has the fovea in the lower rear quadrant of the retina (unlike directly in the back like in humans) so that the greatest acuity is in this upward-forward direction. It's probably like this in most pelagics that strike upward. Most important in this whole discussion is that it is likely that most of these fish don't see color.

    In contrast, dorado have multiple visual pigments and probably see color pretty well, and more than likely yellowtail do as well. So then you're left with having to decide which fish might be more easily fooled by pink vs. clear. I don't have those answers, but I continue to have success with both pink and clear fluorocarbon.

    As an aside, YFT have an olfactory sensitivity for fish odor that's been measured to 10 to the minus 16 (0.0000000000000001).
    That would seem to indicate that they locate prey from longer distances by smell, and only rely on vision in the final rush to the prey at close range.

    Oh yeah, and what do YOU know about all this? ;) (To save him the trouble of responding, folks, he knows ALL about all this - trust me.)

    Thanks Bruce….great info……

    so when you hook a tuna in the dark at 150 feet does the tuna find your sardine/squid by vibration and smell ?????

    Bigger question, when you hook a tuna in the dark at 150 feet with pink fluoro and a stinky, lively sardine/squid, does Fishybuzz still win the raffle?
    :D
     
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    $norkle

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    Oh yeah, and what do YOU know about all this? ;) (To save him the trouble of responding, folks, he knows ALL about all this - trust me.)



    Bigger question, when you hook a tuna in the dark at 150 feet with pink fluoro and a stinky, lively sardine/squid, does Fishybuzz still win the raffle?
    :D

    Fishy always wins the raffle!!! That's one of Newton's Laws.

    About tuna in the dark. There's a couple things to consider. First, notice how large a tuna's eye is. They are adapted to seeing in very low light levels; much less light than a human can see in. They achieve this by pooling those sensitive rods. Secondly, they are probably also still silhouetting their prey visually in low light. I'm sure at close range they are sensitive to vibrations from a lively bait---not too sure about a sluggish one. For trolling they are attracted by the noise/vibrations of a passing boat. In the absence of any vibrations, YFT usually rise to the surface layers about once every hour and then descend after only a couple/few minutes(determined by monitoring tagged YFT in Hawaii). Without any proof, it's a pretty good bet (inference) that they are sniffing the moving surface water trying to detect prey. If they do detect prey they will follow the concentration gradient of the odor to it's source. What this logically infers is that one reason LR boats attract these fish, even when we can't get them to bite, is that the flow-through bait tanks are constantly pumping out "scented" water to be carried by the currents.
     
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