Long Range fishing: Observations after 1st Trip

[JTE]

OK, went on my 1st Long Range trip recently and had a good time. Flew from Florida for an 11 day trip, brought my own rod/reel setups and tackle. I'm 69 years old (almost 70), have been fishing for my entire life, have fished a lot of places around the world, everything from freshwater bream to 350lb mako. Some observations:

- The terminology you westcoaster/long rangers use is different than what I'm used to but I was able to get that sorted out (mostly).
- The conventions you guys have for topshots/leader use is different than what I'm used to.
-To me, a topshot is a long piece of mono line, tied or spliced on top of the main braid line - it would usually be at least 100' long, but could be longer. Never heard of using a top shot of less pound test than the main line. Purpose is to add some stretch into the "string" and to reduce visibility (to the fish) of the line.
- A leader is a piece of wire, mono, or flourocarbon line, or a combination - usually 35' or less in length. Can be spliced, tied, or attached with a swivel/snap to the main line. Purposes multiple: prevent bite off, more abrasion resistant than main line (or top shot), reduce visibility. Never heard of using a leader of less pound test than the main line and don't see any rationale for doing so.

Why use a topshot or leader of less pound test rating than the main line? If the fish are leader shy and you need smaller/less visible, drop down the pound test rating of the entire setup. The "string" is only as strong as it's weakest link. Doesn't make sense to fish an 80lb setup with a 50lb floro leader (I see this convention mentioned often) - you can only apply so much drag to the weakest link. In the case of 50lb leader, if you can land the fish with 15lb of drag, use a 50lb setup - the 50lb setup will be lighter and easier to handle than an 80.

When I come back out for another long range trip, I'll bring probably 6 setups, as follows (and really don't see reason for more):
- 30 or 40 lb, conventional (Fathom narrow 30 2 speed) or spinning reel, on 7' rod, for making bait and small school yellowfin.
- 50lb, big spinner (BG8000) on 8' rod, for throwing wahoo bombs/jigs.
- 50lb, conventional (Fathom narrow 30 2 speed), on 7' rod, for school yellowfin up to 80lb.
- 65lb, conventional (Fathom narrow 40 2 speed) on 7' rail rod, for yellowfin up to 150lb and bottom fishing.
- 80 or 100lb (probably 100), conventional (MK20IISEa) on 7' rail rod, for yellowfin up to 350lb and bottom fishing.
- extra ?lb setup, for ?
- Floro in 30, 50, 60, 80 and 130 lb test.
- No top shots on reels, long floro leaders (at least 8'), rated at at least main line rating.
- good 4X hooks, all size ranges.

Fishing, either live bait or throwing lures, off the transom of a 30' wide boat with 28 other guys is tough fishing, something I'm not used to. Can be a clusterfXXk.

Long range fishing trips involve alot (many hours) of "boat riding". "Boat riding" can get boring. Just a comment.

Being confined to a small floating island, for many days, works out better if the group is compatible. (see comment above). Any way to confirm/address probable compatibility before booking a trip? Don't get me wrong, some real nice guys on the trip I was on.

The wife an I are really enjoying the 150 lbs of yellowfin and wahoo I shipped back. Somehow the one yellowtail I caught didn't make it into the processors shipping box, oh well.

More to come, JTE

 

[swami 805]

Using a leader or top shot smaller than the braid makes perfect sense so if it breaks you still have all your braid.
Casting lures. Pick your spots, if you see a cluster brewing hang back a bit, it will ease up in short order. Try the bow too
Crowded boat, find a limited load and pay a few more duckets Worth it
,to me anyway More mellow crowd on longer trips usually
I always enjoyed the boat ride, I’m one of those clowns who rides the boat back from Cabo. Relax,enjoy the ocean, the fine dining

 

[CMYSIX]

With today's spectra it allows you to have a much heavier main line then the "old day's" and a lot more of it on the reel so why not? as far as 80 pound spectra goes WHY? 80 is just about the same diameter as 100 and it cost's the same if not more then 100, so every thing I have in that line class is spooled with 100. I fly in also so you will find flying or even shipping with 8 foot rods almost impossible. so ALL my rods are 6.5-7 foot and I only bring 7 set ups,

TRQ 15 NLD 325 yds 50 solid
TRQ 25 NLD 325 50 solid, 125 60 hollow
12T "super 12" 575 100 hollow
VISX 16 600 100 hollow
20T 625 yards 100 hollow
30 VISX 'HICAP" 425 100 hollow 200 130 hollow
50S 625 130 hollow

I agree with you on matching the topshot to mainline and if I need to go down on goes a swivel and a short leader just can not wait for JANUARY 6 2022! 16 DAY

 

[Tunahead]

Well glad you got a load of Yellowfin and Wahoo to enjoy all winter. I too thought the
long boat ride sucked after a couple longer trips many moons ago. .

Trading tackle tricks can be a learning experience, or boring as hell to some. Any trip is what you make it. Like I say...
"YOU'LL NEVER KNOW, UNLESS YOU GO"
GL on your next trip.

 

[JTE]

So Swami, you always use a lighter leader than your mainline? (If not, there goes your argument)

 

[woodfish330]

Brother.... your not from another planet...lol. We all face the same learning curve.... each in his own way. Yours is not that different... than those of us here on the West Coast....even though the terminology may be different... the basic ideas are the same.

Your East Coast experience is an advantage... if you open up your minds eye... to see what "crosses over" well ... with those techniques of the West Coast Long Range Angler.

As for the few "jack asses" on EVERY TRIP... you just need to find the right Group/Charter. I have been a Charter Master dozens of times... know who will always cause problems... and how to keep it light enough for the rest to enjoy their trip. So... dont book the SAME trip for next year.... try another boat.... another Charter.... another Group. Chances are.... you'll find the right anglers to share your trip with.

Good luck.... and thanks for posting here on BD. We're here to help Brother...

 

[wahoodad]

Kinda seems to me you came here wanting to hold onto East Coast ideals. If I came to the your neck of the woods, I would see what you all recommend (with the exception of spinning reels, no thanks on those)
I can't speak for anybody else, but there is a method to my madness. Say using heavier braid than leader (I'll say leader, I've always hated the term topshot) Maybe my wahoo bait outfit, 30# leader material, but I might have the reel filled with 65# braid!
Why you ask? COST! It might be a lot more expensive to fill the spool with 30# braid, actually cost less to use a heavier braid, and as long as I meet my ideal yardage of line, I actually save money.
Then, I set the drag according to the 30# test leader.
Here's one that freaks a lot of people out: until I get to a really large reel (50 or 50W), I fill my reel with 80# hollow, ( on my Mac 16, 20 and 30 sized reels), even though my leader material might be 100#, 130#, 150#, etc! I want the capacity when going after big fish.
I've never had the braid break, and have landed fish this way including my PB YFT!

So yeah, we're a bit different out here. I personally hate being in that nausea of everyone in the stern. I've had a lot of bites walking rapidly to the bow, drop my bait in there and walk back to the crowd. before the current weaves me into the nausea, I wind in and do it again. Sometimes it pays to think outside the box.

All in all, it's a great experience. Nice big boats, helpful crews, very good food, nice accommodations. You will learn more on every trip. Hope you stick with it.

 

[FishRock]

JTE,

Thanks for posting your perspectives.

I have lived in many places across the USA and there is usually a noticeable change in jargon for common things from place to place but those from Cali have to admit that So Cal takes the cake for jargon and that bleeds directly into the So Cal Long Range fishing world. Fishing for dodo and skins. Half dozen names for most any given knot. Nothing at all wrong with that but it can seem like a foreign language at times to someone who has not been exposed to it.

And in the spirit of the holidays please remember "The Dude Abides".

 

[Amadeus]

For 80, 100, or higher main, same weight for main and top shot is OK unless more abrasion resistance is wanted (then the top shot is bumped up)

For 65 braid, 60, 50, or 40 top shot...have yet to see 65 mono or fluoro.

50 to 50 is the lowest I am willing to have main = top shot rating, and only in a pinch at that.

Everything else lower than 50 has main rating > top shot rating. IMHO, the probability of popping the line goes higher with lighter lines so if it happens, want break at top shot and not at main. Have had one instance with a tangle where the main line had frayed and had to be spliced after cutting off the bad section and salvaging the remainder (~50 yards).

Most applications for SD Long Range can work with short top shots.

Most SD Long Range is also known as "combat fishing" for the reasons you experienced at the rail. The "long ride" is unavoidable given where the target fishing grounds are; getting longer recently because of Mex island closures.

Once you hand off your catch to a fish processor, you are at their mercy...nature of the beast.

If you jump on an open sign-up trip, the probability increases of "that guy" or "those guys" showing up. Have fished LR with the same group since 2014 for that very reason and haven't looked back. May you find a group(s) that work for you.

 

[craig ito]

Leaving 1-1-22…can’t wait…sounds like the coasts fish differently…I fish big and heavy to land the fish of a lifetime…first few trips were about numbers, now I fish for that ONE…fish hard in the morning, skipjack and sinker rig, drop the jig a bit in the dark, seems like my bigger fish come then…I fish my 80 with 200# leader with a one to one in low gear, my winch….throughout the day pending on conditions (mostly current) I’ll fish the dean, use a 50 or 30 size reel with 130lb flouro…..drop a chunk or two….try and mix it up and establish some kind of pattern….I try not fish less than 130 for the tuna, unless we are into those smaller fish, but any thing over 80-100 lb fish I’m using 130…the last few years been interesting with the blues within range on the way down…that relaxing four day boat ride turn a bit wild when you can be into the fish the next day…usually don’t bother busting gear out till day 2..lol….could be bluefin and wahoo (at the rocks )before we get to the bank! That would be cool…the wahoo is my favorite to bring home, the occasional exotic pargo, grouper, is always accepted…gonna try dropping the knife jig a little more this trip and see if the yellowfin down there eat it like the blues do…now the kite….can make you or break you…sometimes that kite gets going and your flying through the rotation…found that it’s reall important to pay attention to your turn when the kite is going off!!you don’t want to be the one who is not ready and they are waiting for you and the school moves and bite shuts off…sometimes it feels like punishment baking in the sun holding the big rod! Lol..you know what I mean…if you see some life (birds,etc) do the Pyle driver…manifest that bite…real that flyer 20 feet in the air and free spool making a splash…try a few times, got bit like that several times…shhh….shit gotta go back to work…last day I’m pumped!!!

 

[wahoodad]

Most SD Long Range is also known as "combat fishing" for the reasons you experienced at the rail. The "long ride" is unavoidable given where the target fishing grounds are; getting longer recently because of Mex island closures.

"Combat fishing"? Man, haven't seen that in long range fishing in many many years.

 

[Bill W]

You are right about topshot and leader definition. Keep in mind that we grew up in a different type of fishing. Live bait and live chum. You are also right about the purpose of a larger leader than the main line but other factors are involved. Like you said people are close together on the stern. So the tricks are to play off the sides and to cast away from the stern line angles. It is a different game with different rules to the game that has plus and minus. Remember… we have been doing this dance for a very long time. Spectra and leader. Spectra has plus and minus. The minus is abrasion. As far as combat fishing, I kinda point to overnight boat fishing or day boat fishing. If you go on longer long range the passengers are less. Makes a big difference going with 24 or less than over 28-30.

 

[Tunahead]

Kinda seems to me you came here wanting to hold onto East Coast ideals. If I came to the your neck of the woods, I would see what you all recommend (with the exception of spinning reels, no thanks on those)
I can't speak for anybody else, but there is a method to my madness. Say using heavier braid than leader (I'll say leader, I've always hated the term topshot) Maybe my wahoo bait outfit, 30# leader material, but I might have the reel filled with 65# braid!
Why you ask? COST! It might be a lot more expensive to fill the spool with 30# braid, actually cost less to use a heavier braid, and as long as I meet my ideal yardage of line, I actually save money.
Then, I set the drag according to the 30# test leader.
Here's one that freaks a lot of people out: until I get to a really large reel (50 or 50W), I fill my reel with 80# hollow, ( on my Mac 16, 20 and 30 sized reels), even though my leader material might be 100#, 130#, 150#, etc! I want the capacity when going after big fish.
I've never had the braid break, and have landed fish this way including my PB YFT!

So yeah, we're a bit different out here. I personally hate being in that nausea of everyone in the stern. I've had a lot of bites walking rapidly to the bow, drop my bait in there and walk back to the crowd. before the current weaves me into the nausea, I wind in and do it again. Sometimes it pays to think outside the box.

All in all, it's a great experience. Nice big boats, helpful crews, very good food, nice accommodations. You will learn more on every trip. Hope you stick with it.

I'll 2nd all of that.

 

[Tunahead]

"Combat fishing"? Man, haven't seen that in long range fishing in many many years.

At least not since the weekly Albacore trips

 

[Sawmill killer]

@JTE did you happen to keep the receipt from the processor and contact them about your missing YT? If you used Five Star they write on the receipt # of fish and weight so I'm sure they would want to correct the situation.

I've only gone to SD 3 times (multiple 2.5-3 day trips each time) and feel your pain on the combat fishing, it's easy peasy on some boats and a nightmare on others depending on the people next to you. I find taking a minute or two with a cold beer in hand to regroup then hit the bow with a fresh bait makes all the difference when dealing with "that guy"

 

[2Rotten]

OP thanks for writing up your observations. I was new to all this until a few years ago as well, doing most of my fishing in Oregon.

Floro in 30, 50, 60, 80 and 130 lb test.
For me, I take out the 50, and add back in 40 and 100. Particularly if you get into a BFT bite, 40# fluoro gives you a better chance of landing the fish than 30, and generally gets bit better than 50. I like 100 fluoro a lot for leader material fishing big jigs at night, primarily BFT. 130 would also work.

No top shots on reels, long floro leaders (at least 8'), rated at at least main line rating
If you have extra picky fish (often BFT) I would use minimum 20' fluoro leader

For lighter leader I like my braid 1 or 2 sizes larger than leader. This is primarily for abrasion resistance for me; if you get accidentally caught in a tangle, you have a little better chance of still catching your fish with heavier main line (say 65# braid paired with 30 or 40# fluoro).

Good 4X hooks, all size ranges.
If you get into schools of modest size fish (YFT or Dorado) a 4X hook is actually a detriment. Heavier hook just makes it harder for your sardine to swim as fast as possible, and the thicker wire hooks do not penetrate as easily as thin wire hooks. I bring Gorilla hooks for YT. Inexpensive Mustad Bronze 92677 hooks in size 1, 1/0 and 2/0 are worth adding to your bag, unless you are only targeting Cows.

Good luck on future endeavors!

 

[vegasandre]

There are a few on here who have equal time on the East and West Coasts (or have Fished LR a lot from the East Coast.. John from Trophy Tackle,Basil..etc..) and some are lucky enough to also have fished world wide and seen a lot of things.
Each coast can learn and have learned techniques from the other coast that can apply to each coast. Some of the original techniques on SD boats can trace their beginnings to East coast and some vice versa..
I think though everyone gets stuck in their habits and what they are accustomed too.

It is good to think outside the box or learn and adapt no matter what your age/experience/location..
you can learn a ton on SD LR boats as well as a ton on the beaches of the Northeast and a ton fishing the gulf stream on the East Coast of FLA or wherever.. and apply some of that to the other locations.
it works wonders.
I was a Mate in NJ and moved to West Coast in my Early 30's. My time there throwing Lures for Stripers in the Surf..riggid eels..poppers for Bluefish/Albies to Chunkin Tuna have greatly helped me in my WC endeavors. And the WC "extreme knowledge" of everything regarding live bait and presentaion has greatly helped me as well.

I love SD LR fishing.

Be open to new Ideas . but whatever you do -do not call Mahi Mahi- "Dolphin"..

 

[hucklongfin]

Don't pay attention to the line rating, pay attention to the diameter! The heavier braid is still smaller in diameter than the lighter leader/top shot! I use heavier leader than the main line on my popping/lure rigs for bite off protection. I use 3' leaders and the extra diameter with a lure doesn't matter.

 

[jer dog]

There are a few on here who have equal time on the East and West Coasts (or have Fished LR a lot from the East Coast.. John from Trophy Tackle,Basil..etc..) and some are lucky enough to also have fished world wide and seen a lot of things.
Each coast can learn and have learned techniques from the other coast that can apply to each coast. Some of the original techniques on SD boats can trace their beginnings to East coast and some vice versa..
I think though everyone gets stuck in their habits and what they are accustomed too.

It is good to think outside the box or learn and adapt no matter what your age/experience/location..
you can learn a ton on SD LR boats as well as a ton on the beaches of the Northeast and a ton fishing the gulf stream on the East Coast of FLA or wherever.. and apply some of that to the other locations.
it works wonders.
I was a Mate in NJ and moved to West Coast in Early 30's. My time there throwing Lures for Stripers in the Surf..riggid eels..poppers for Bluefish/Albies to Chunkin Tuna have greatly helped me in my WC endeavors. And the WC "extreme knowledge" of everything regarding live bait and presentaion has greatly helped me as well.

I love SD LR fishing.

Be open to new Ideas . but whatever you do -do not call Mahi Mahi- "Dolphin"..

yep me too, fished out of Glouster MA ,and PT Judith RI ,for about four years
for Cod , and it was A trip to find out what A drag was on A Reel was,

 

[Tunahead]

yep me too, fished out of Glouster MA ,and PT Judith RI ,for about four years
for Cod , and it was A trip to find out what A drag was on A Reel was,

Too cool. You passed. I got schooled too.
Early 60's I learned what my new
Jigmaster 500 star drag was with Eddie McEwen on Pacific Queen at Iron Bound cove, 5am, I got scolded for having the drag buttoned down all the way tight.
"You wanna get yanked over the side son"???

 

[Amadeus]

"Combat fishing"? Man, haven't seen that in long range fishing in many many years.

"Combat" evolves with the conditions. The examples of 48 anglers on the Blackjack and 68 on the Q105...could make the argument that's analogous to WWI trench warfare (which reappeared in the more recent Iran-Iraq war).

28 other people concurrently tossing live bait and lures on the stern may not be on the same level as 48 or 68, but not exactly a-walk-in-the-park either to a first-timer or others.

 

[vipertom1970]

OP, look for limited load LR with less than 22 guys will make the trip more enjoyable. My very first 10 Day LR fishing trip was with 32 guys and that was not fun and now I fish with 22 guys max for LR.

 

[Tom Honaker]

OK, went on my 1st Long Range trip recently and had a good time. Flew from Florida for an 11 day trip, brought my own rod/reel setups and tackle. I'm 69 years old (almost 70), have been fishing for my entire life, have fished a lot of places around the world, everything from freshwater bream to 350lb mako. Some observations:

- The terminology you westcoaster/long rangers use is different than what I'm used to but I was able to get that sorted out (mostly).
- The conventions you guys have for topshots/leader use is different than what I'm used to.
-To me, a topshot is a long piece of mono line, tied or spliced on top of the main braid line - it would usually be at least 100' long, but could be longer. Never heard of using a top shot of less pound test than the main line. Purpose is to add some stretch into the "string" and to reduce visibility (to the fish) of the line.
- A leader is a piece of wire, mono, or flourocarbon line, or a combination - usually 35' or less in length. Can be spliced, tied, or attached with a swivel/snap to the main line. Purposes multiple: prevent bite off, more abrasion resistant than main line (or top shot), reduce visibility. Never heard of using a leader of less pound test than the main line and don't see any rationale for doing so.

Why use a topshot or leader of less pound test rating than the main line? If the fish are leader shy and you need smaller/less visible, drop down the pound test rating of the entire setup. The "string" is only as strong as it's weakest link. Doesn't make sense to fish an 80lb setup with a 50lb floro leader (I see this convention mentioned often) - you can only apply so much drag to the weakest link. In the case of 50lb leader, if you can land the fish with 15lb of drag, use a 50lb setup - the 50lb setup will be lighter and easier to handle than an 80.

When I come back out for another long range trip, I'll bring probably 6 setups, as follows (and really don't see reason for more):
- 30 or 40 lb, conventional (Fathom narrow 30 2 speed) or spinning reel, on 7' rod, for making bait and small school yellowfin.
- 50lb, big spinner (BG8000) on 8' rod, for throwing wahoo bombs/jigs.
- 50lb, conventional (Fathom narrow 30 2 speed), on 7' rod, for school yellowfin up to 80lb.
- 65lb, conventional (Fathom narrow 40 2 speed) on 7' rail rod, for yellowfin up to 150lb and bottom fishing.
- 80 or 100lb (probably 100), conventional (MK20IISEa) on 7' rail rod, for yellowfin up to 350lb and bottom fishing.
- extra ?lb setup, for ?
- Floro in 30, 50, 60, 80 and 130 lb test.
- No top shots on reels, long floro leaders (at least 8'), rated at at least main line rating.
- good 4X hooks, all size ranges.

Fishing, either live bait or throwing lures, off the transom of a 30' wide boat with 28 other guys is tough fishing, something I'm not used to. Can be a clusterfXXk.

Long range fishing trips involve alot (many hours) of "boat riding". "Boat riding" can get boring. Just a comment.

Being confined to a small floating island, for many days, works out better if the group is compatible. (see comment above). Any way to confirm/address probable compatibility before booking a trip? Don't get me wrong, some real nice guys on the trip I was on.

The wife an I are really enjoying the 150 lbs of yellowfin and wahoo I shipped back. Somehow the one yellowtail I caught didn't make it into the processors shipping box, oh well.

More to come, JTE

The San Diego long range fleet is the best at what they do, technique and tackle perfected over the years, for a live bait fishery. I can understand how it may seem strange to someone who has little experience long range fishing. There can be significant travel time to get to your destination, but I guarantee the Captain and crew are doing everything in there power to put you on World class fishing destination. You want a shot at a Cow yellowfin, 4 days travel each way, unless there at the lower banks and than it's 3 days. When in Rome, do as the Roman's do! Glad you caught caught some decent fish! Probably not a lot of catching wahoo on jigs and bombs in Florida. Catching them on jigs in my opinion, is one of the coolest things you can do with your pants on!

 

[ifish42na]

Tuna fishing in the middle of 300 boats drifting overnight packed into the 100 square at Hudson Canyon, that’s combat fishing. 24 guys on a SD long range boat with 2 chefs and 6 crew, 900 miles out of port, that’s a vacation. Embrace it.

 

[Steve K]

When I think of combat fishing, sometimes the battle ensues because the fish are biting too good. A nice sensible plunker on an offshore drift is pretty cool, one to three hanging. Whether it’s an attack from Yellowfin or a trip I remember with Albacore, it can be pretty chaotic.

On the Legend out of Seaforth many years ago, crew members were Aaron Barnhill, Matt Romaine and another named Ben. Not Long Range, but I distinctly remember Aaron on his knees at the rail with a handful of lines and he said: “I’ve seen six way tangles before, but never three on the same stop!”

Fast forward to a trip on the Rooster, fishing Wahoo on the Ridge. After a 3-4 way jig strike, we hooked a bunch more and the tangles were not as user friendly for the crew. Wahoo can really make a mess of things, like Fish on Meth!