Live Bait Invention -- Thoughts?

tanner.s

Fish Slaughterer
Oct 18, 2012
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I was thinking that using a shock mount and gyro would not only reduce slosh and banging but would serve as a barrier to vibration. Not your idea but would be pretty cool to see a test on that.

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MYNomad

Heading South
Dec 12, 2007
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Rick
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I was thinking that using a shock mount and gyro would not only reduce slosh and banging but would serve as a barrier to vibration. Not your idea but would be pretty cool to see a test on that.

Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk

Just so you know, most of my trips are multi-day. The reason I like them so much is that it gives me a chance to ponder silly little things, as opposed to my hectic, normal day-to-day existence where everything has real consequences.

During those trips, the health and welfare of my bait frequently become the focus of my attention. To the extent that I have spent countless hours engaged in thought experiments (ala Einstein) about how their plight might be improved. I have considered many possibilities, including stabilization. As with my day-to-day problem solving thoughts, I try to begin by imagining a world in which practical limitations do not exist. However, even in that imagined circumstance, I don't see stabilization making the difference between life and death of most of the baits.

I have concluded, rightly or wrongly, though based on the number of hours of thought I have devoted to this question, I believe rightly, that the major cause of mortality is something different.

Frankly, it was an epiphany. One evening, late during my watch, after checking on the engine room and then the bait, that I decided to examine the problem from the perspective of Maslow and his heierarchy of needs theory. Then it hit me. I imagined myself as a little sardine (or perhaps a chovy), and realized that the greatest threat to my raison d'être (catching my owner a big fish), was easily mitigated.

Then and there I began my quest. I may be wrong (and heaven knows I have bet on many sure things that have lost), but at this stage of my life I am in need of a legacy. (Not that I am on the verge of dying, but I need to be remembered for something other than what I have achieved thus far. My hope and dream is that future generations, using my device, say, God blessed us with Rick's idea. Now that may sound blasphemous, but I don't intend it that way at all. I give full credit to my creator for all of my numerous blessings.)

Anyway, the parts arrived earlier in this week. But for mothers day, I will make huge progress on my prototype this weekend. One obstacle, my wife bought me this stuff for my brithday, which is another week or so off.
 
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tanner.s

Fish Slaughterer
Oct 18, 2012
1,896
599
San Diego
Name
Tanner
Boat
1997 Proline 23 W/A
Just so you know, most of my trips are multi-day. The reason I like them so much is that it gives me a chance to ponder silly little things, as opposed to my hectic, normal day-to-day existence where everything has real consequences.

During those trips, the health and welfare of my bait frequently become the focus of my attention. To the extent that I have spent countless hours engaged in thought experiments (ala Einstein) about how their plight might be improved. I have considered many possibilities, including stabilization. As with my day-to-day problem solving thoughts, I try to begin by imagining a world in which practical limitations do not exist. However, even in that imagined circumstance, I don't see stabilization making the difference between life and death of most of the baits.

I have concluded, rightly or wrongly, though based on the number of hours of thought I have devoted to this question, I believe rightly, that the major cause of mortality is something different.

Frankly, it was an epiphany. One evening, late during my watch, after checking on the engine room and then the bait, that I decided to examine the problem from the perspective of Maslow and his heierarchy of needs theory. Then it hit me. I imagined myself as a little sardine (or perhaps a chovy), and realized that the greatest threat to my raison d'être (catching my owner a big fish), was easily mitigated.

Then and there I began my quest. I may be wrong (and heaven knows I have bet on many sure things that have lost), but at this stage of my life I am in need of a legacy. (Not that I am on the verge of dying, but I need to be remembered for something other than what I have achieved thus far. My hope and dream is that future generations, using my device, say, God blessed us with Rick's idea. Now that may sound blasphemous, but I don't intend it that way at all. I give full credit to my creator for all of my numerous blessings.)

Anyway, the parts arrived earlier in this week. But for mothers day, I will make huge progress on my prototype this weekend. One obstacle, my wife bought me this stuff for my brithday, which is another week or so off.
Had a good laugh over some of the imagery created while reading this post - I could imagine you hovering over the tank in deep thought for days on the open ocean, haha.

You have us all intrigued, I think a sneak peek is in order.
 
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Hooops

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"...Then it hit me. I imagined myself as a little sardine (or perhaps a chovy), and realized that the greatest threat to my raison d'être (catching my owner a big fish), was easily mitigated."

Rick - no more mushrooms on those multi-day trips.
 
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Marcus

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mullet

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mike
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Tank looks great,40 kts in the dark not so much.
 
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Blackfish

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.
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kindafishy

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duckbutter6a

Florida man living in SoCal
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Problems for people with far more time and money than I.

Interesting none the less.

If you ever need help figuring out how to calculate fuel, ammo, and food consumption for a Mechanized Infantry Brigade in a war zone hit me up.
 
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MYNomad

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Update with some details:

I have made good (but slow) progress on my "invention". It has two aspects: monitoring and improving oxygen levels in the bait tank. The conventional method of improving oxygen levels is to increase flow rate. The problem with that is if the oxygen level is sufficient/good, any additional flow is bad for the bait, particularly when 1) the water is warm, 2) the bait are crowded, 3) the seas are rough, 4) the bait are stressed.

To address the first half of the problem, my device monitors the level of dissolved oxygen going into the bait tank, and the level going out, the difference being the oxygen consumption by bait. My device sends that info wirelessly to a computer for on-screen graphical presentation. Since not everyone has a computer on board, I have a version that displays on a little color LCD screen, but expecially while I dial this in, I prefer the big screen view and extra processing power of a real computer.

Anyway, here is a screen shot. When I get a chance, I will write some notes on here to show what everything means, but in a nutshell, the vertical bar at the far left represents the range of oxygen concentration that I display. At the bottom (red), is a level of about 4 mg/litre (not enough for baitfish), and at the top is 100% saturated 68 degree water (bait heaven). At the top of the screen is the quality (ie oxygen content) of incomming water. The first thing that limits that quality is water temp. As water temp increases, oxygen carrying capacity (even at 100% saturation) decreases. The white line shows how much oxygen is in 100% saturated water at the temperature of the incoming water (unfortunately, my temp probe is not working correctly (yet), so I have fixed that temp to about what my water temp is -- soon that will vary as water temp varies.)

The bottom half of the screen shows the oxygen content of the outgoing water. I don't have this calibrated yet, and will need some species-specific info. For now it is just a guess as to the level at which the oxygen level is dangerously low (yellow). I think that what is currently showing as yellow is probably light green.

The white area in the middle represents oxygen consumed by the bait.

On the right of the screen, you will notice a vertical black line. To the right of that are up to 30 individual samples taken a little over 3 seconds apart. Once 30 samples are accumulated, they are averaged into one sample and moved to the front of the left side of the screen. That let's me see what is happening right now (and for the last minute or so), and what has happened for the last several hours (it takes about 17 hours to fill the screen up. I will probably adjust so that it takes 24 hours, or maybe 12. But I want to be able to see what happened overnight, because I believe incoming oxygen levels drop at night when the algae/phytoplankton stop producing oxygen (like plants).

The second aspect of my device improves the oxygen saturation. In experiments, I have been able to achieve better than 100% saturation. I am still fine-tuning, and improving, but have not yet hit 100% in the tank.

DO Graph pic 7_23.jpg
 
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kindafishy

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ok i'll bite, so how do you get more oxygen saturation?
 
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apogee

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Everybody send ME $659.00, I have a secret too.. Do not delay send me the money now..
 
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junkyardEd

Special Baiter Wizard
Nov 27, 2008
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ok i'll bite, so how do you get more oxygen saturation?

I'm gonna inject some sponges with oxygen then put them in my bait tank. When the sponges soak up water that will push the oxygen out and the water will absorb it.
 
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dragonballs

I'm off probation
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    I like it keep it coming


    For the haters we just ran 56 miles to find 150 dollars of bait died

    Still got more albies than you boys in Cali. Got 11 on the troll
     
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    kindafishy

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    im not a hater or a naysayer. i'm trying to learn.
    i have little interest in monitoring the levels of oxygen, but if i can get 100% saturation that would be great. its the last thing i think i'll need for my system. i've already converted mine to a pressurized tank with good results.
     
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    MYNomad

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    Tiny bubbles is sort of correct, but they have to be REALLY tiny -- tiny enough to dissolve. Oxygen doesn't dissolve from just an air/water interface very quickly and the bubbles themselves can create problems. Moreover, you can't get more than 100% saturation through aeration.
     
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    kindafishy

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    Tiny bubbles is sort of correct, but they have to be REALLY tiny -- tiny enough to dissolve. Oxygen doesn't dissolve from just an air/water interface very quickly and the bubbles themselves can create problems. Moreover, you can't get more than 100% saturation through aeration.

    yes thats right! air and water agitated, like a waterfall is whats needed as i understand it. i've been trying to find a way to incorporate this into my system. (which i've eliminated "slosh and agitation" in)
     
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    SouthBayKiller

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    I don't know what that stands for but probably not. I don't think there is a name for my process, and it is definitely not the Islamic Society of Orange County.
    Lol, iSOC is an oxygen diffusion technology used in the environmental remediation industry (which I happen to be a part of). Easily able to super saturate water with dissolved oxygen, but it would require a constant supply of O2, which is typically provided via compressed cylinder which is bulky and potentially unsafe.
     
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    MYNomad

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    Lol, iSOC is an oxygen diffusion technology used in the environmental remediation industry (which I happen to be a part of). Easily able to super saturate water with dissolved oxygen, but it would require a constant supply of O2, which is typically provided via compressed cylinder which is bulky and potentially unsafe.

    Thanks for the info. Not my approach, but I would be curious to know how the oxygen is diffused into the water -- anything more elaborate than a fancy aerator?

    BTW, and I am sure you have heard this before, but the only thing I know about maz mat remediation is "the solution to pollution is dilution".
     
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    SouthBayKiller

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    1. Thanks for the info. Not my approach, but I would be curious to know how the oxygen is diffused into the water -- anything more elaborate than a fancy aerator?
    BTW, and I am sure you have heard this before, but the only thing I know about maz mat remediation is "the solution to pollution is dilution".
    I've talked with the distributor of the product and basically it's a tiny tiny tube made of an osmotic material that allows the O2 to diffuse. The tube is very very thin, think like a piece of mono or hollow spectra. The tube is running up and down continuously creating a huge surface area inside the device. My understand is that due to the pressure and concentration gradients created, the water is absorbing the O2. There is almost no bubbles coming off the product, except by design occasionally one comes up to confirm there is still pressure on the system. We routinely see DO levels above 35mg/L in wells we monitor with these systems. And it's not like soda, it's purely dissolved. By raising the DO our clients are able to drive geochemistry and basically force oxidation reactions by adding so much O2. So if you have a gas tank leaking underground in the water table, you add proportionally massive amounts of O2 you end up with CO2 and water. There are many ways to skin the cat and the iSOC is just one of the knives used. It just stuck out to me that it could possibly be the same or similar technology used to provide large amounts of O2 in bait tank water.

    Regarding dilution, it's really not the case at all. Most of the sites I'm dealing with if you diluted by 1/2 or more your concentrations would still be way over threshold values but your polluted area would be doubled. Hazards underground are handled in two ways: in-situ or remove and treat. ISOC is one of litterally hundreds of methods of in situ remediation (taking harmful substance and changing it to no -harmful by products. Removal is likely where you see the dilution (I only deal with it while it's in the ground), as my guess is waste generated during the removal process could potentially be "blended" (industry term for dilution).
     
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