Line-Knot testing machine

GaffnLaff

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Walt
Sorry I gave you homework. My guess was 100% knot, not another bullard at the scale, but I see the logic and I'm sure it will work. When my new scale gets here I will have a new hobby, real confidence in my connections, and the ability to prove other connections inferior. Thanks for taking the time to explain all of this and post photos.
Dave
 
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gecsr1

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one the boat winches you are using when you turn the handle how much line in inches is pulled on one click of the winch handle . ?
 
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yessokk

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one the boat winches you are using when you turn the handle how much line in inches is pulled on one click of the winch handle . ?

The gear ratio is 4:1
The diameter of the wind on spool for the cable is 1"
1 Click equals about 1/16"
1 Complete turn of the handle equals 3/4"
The cable diameter is .065" source, Home Depot
 
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yessokk

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Walt
Sorry I gave you homework. My guess was 100% knot, not another bullard at the scale, but I see the logic and I'm sure it will work. When my new scale gets here I will have a new hobby, real confidence in my connections, and the ability to prove other connections inferior. Thanks for taking the time to explain all of this and post photos.
Dave

Well..... yes I do use a knot for the task. For Mono and Fluoro a modified Trilene knot is used. The number of wraps can vary depending on the test of the line. For 20# 6-7 up and 6-7 back down usually does it. But that will change on pound test and manufacture and if fluoro is used. For spectra I usually wrap it around the base bullard and connect the mono/fluoro to the scale either via a test hook with the trilene knot or use the additional bullard if the knot starts breaking . Perfecting that modified trilene is probably one of the first to perfect as you will end up using it quite a bit.
The pic show testing a knot using the dummy hook that has had the hook point ground off and bent closed so it stays put on the hook clip to the scale and use the same hook to attach line to for the line to line test. The 2nd pic showing how to tie the modified trilene knot.




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zimezoom

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Hi Folks, I'm happy to find this thread :)
Thanks a lot for your inspiring ideas.
Let me show you something, that can be use of you too.
It's sort of fixture, that does not weaken the line, and don't waste too much line, you use about 1 feet/test.
I combined the not-a-knot snap with the principle of the bollard-style grips, used on tensile test machines. You begin to wrap the line, as if you were tying an ordinary not-a-knot snap, then go around the plastic disc 1-2 times.
That's it.
The line will break anywhere, but not at the fixture.
The plastic disk was cut from a pipe plug.
I push a piece of silicon tube into the groove of the black gizmo to stop the line unravelling, when busy with the other end of line.

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Cubeye

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Hi Folks, I'm happy to find this thread :)
Thanks a lot for your inspiring ideas.
Let me show you something, that can be use of you too.
It's sort of fixture, that does not weaken the line, and don't waste too much line, you use about 1 feet/test.
I combined the not-a-knot snap with the principle of the bollard-style grips, used on tensile test machines. You begin to wrap the line, as if you were tying an ordinary not-a-knot snap, then go around the plastic disc 1-2 times.
That's it.
The line will break anywhere, but not at the fixture.
The plastic disk was cut from a pipe plug.
I push a piece of silicon tube into the groove of the black gizmo to stop the line unravelling, when busy with the other end of line.

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Interesting,
So this gizmo is used at the scale end of the testing machine?
Line is wrapped onto it and the eye is hooked onto the scale, while the other end of the test line is anchored to a stationary bollard?

Correct me if I am wrong.
 
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yessokk

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Very clever Mr.Zimezoom. A well thought out solution. If a problem ever develops with line breaking at the gizmo an increase in the diameter will most likely resolve the issue.

Cubeye: Am thinking you are correct hopefully zimezoom will concur.
 
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zimezoom

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Interesting,
So this gizmo is used at the scale end of the testing machine?
Line is wrapped onto it and the eye is hooked onto the scale, while the other end of the test line is anchored to a stationary bollard?

Correct me if I am wrong.

The gizmo is just a prototype, actually I put it together today, just to verify if it works or not. I was happy with it, and had to tell other people, who are able to realize the ingenuity (unlike my wife :D). Can be on both ends, you can connect it to the scale, or/and use instead of the dowel fixed to the bench.
My machine is under construction yet, I have just received this force gauge, and about to build a testing bench.
I'm going to report here about the progress.
I used to test lines and knots until now with a plain fishing scale, without peak hold feature. I wrapped the line on a hammer handle and pulled by hand.
 
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zimezoom

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Very clever Mr.Zimezoom. A well thought out solution. If a problem ever develops with line breaking at the gizmo an increase in the diameter will most likely resolve the issue.

Thank you, I'm happy you like my idea.
I bought one size bigger plugs today just in case, but I think that it's still OK. The arbor and the line diameter is about 1:100 ratio, I don't think it would hurt the line.
 
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yessokk

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Sep 18, 2006
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Zimezoom: you may find this thread helpful

The force gauge you purchased will work great. You got the peak hold feature. An essential feature, would not purchase a scale with out it. However if you ever start testing lines of 130 kg or heavier you will need a heavier scale. Can reccomend either of these scales they both have the Peak Hold feature.

I purchased the 330lb unit.

I started out with this scale 0-110 lbs which works great for
50 and some 60 pound lines. Here is the best pricing I found.
Ignor this just hit the link .
Walt
 
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zimezoom

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Zimezoom: you may find this thread helpful

The force gauge you purchased will work great. You got the peak hold feature. An essential feature, would not purchase a scale with out it. However if you ever start testing lines of 130 kg or heavier you will need a heavier scale. Can reccomend either of these scales they both have the Peak Hold feature. I purchased the 330lb unit.

Walt

Yes, I read it from A to Z, and found it helpful, definitely.
I use 10-30 lbs main lines, so the range of my new force gauge should be pretty enough
 
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zimezoom

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This stirrup-like piece was my first knotless fixture for line testing.
Made up of a metal bow and a foldable wooden dowel.
First I used it with 15-20 turns of line on the dowel, but heavier lines still can slip on the wood, requiring even more turns (pink line pics). I found this way too wasteful, so I modified the gadget with a nail (green line pics).
I double up the line, hang on the nail, then make a few turns around the nail head on the opposite side, and a few more turns around the dowel. Friction on the dowel reduces the stress enough at the clamp point (nail), so that the line will not fail there.
You may see the groove on the middle of the dowel, the lines dug it, so you can imagine, how many times was it used.

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yessokk

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ZZ,,, a big help to stop the slipping is to wrap the wood dowel
with black electrical tape, 1 half overlap layer will do it, this will greatly increase the friction of the line against the dowel.. Try tieng a simple overhand loop knot in the lines end , hook the loop over the bolt, 2-3 wraps around the dowel and you should be good to go.
Walt
 
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Cubeye

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ZZ,,, a big help to stop the slipping is to wrap the wood dowel
with black electrical tape, 1 half overlap layer will do it, this will greatly increase the friction of the line against the dowel.. Try tieng a simple overhand loop knot in the lines end , hook the loop over the bolt, 2-3 wraps around the dowel and you should be good to go.
Walt
Yep. Any type of tape will help to increase the friction. Flex Tape, Friction tape, Electrical tape. I use leather from a old leather glove.
 
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GaffnLaff

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This stirrup-like piece was my first knotless fixture for line testing.
Made up of a metal bow and a foldable wooden dowel.
ZZ,
That's a nice contraption and fine piece of metal bending. How did you bend that rod?
I use bollard(s) similar to Walts, and cover the dowel with shrink tubing.
 
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pukahd

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Oct 30, 2004
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Over the wooden dowels, why not add a few yards of heavy spectra and just connect to sample line with a simple knot. Any tension will stop slipping off the dowels and you only need a few wraps of sample line.
 
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yessokk

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Sep 18, 2006
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Cubeye: so you have made a testing rig? If so please
post up some pice. It's always of interest to see
inventive creations.....:-)
 
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pukahd

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Oct 30, 2004
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Walt, Cubeye, Zimezoom & Ripped, thanks for revisiting this posting. I took information from all you guys to make my tester. Walt was right about not using a spring scale, mines went ka-pow ! there went my 20yr old Manley. I got the recommended from Walt a AWS TL-330 with its “peak hold” function. Works perfect.

I wrapped layers of spectra on the removable dowel on to a wall hook. Tied a Uni to Uni knot with a few wraps of test mono.

Tested 40# Izor XXX mono with a springer knot
Knot broke at 37#’s. Knots always broke within the mid 30’s.


Brian
 
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bigreddog

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That is a really nice testing jig, The holding device and shrapnel guard are great ideas. Having a clear piece of plastic over the top like Locvetter's adds a whole bunch of safety to the process. I have a photo that Utahtuna sent me a few years back of some mono that embedded into a 2X4 during testing, that made an impression on me .
 
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Cubeye

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Cubeye: so you have made a testing rig? If so please
post up some pice. It's always of interest to see
inventive creations.....:-)
No. Not yet. I've gathered most of the parts, designed it, but haven't started making it. Other projects keep getting in the way.
 
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zimezoom

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Walt, Cubeye & Zimezoom, thanks for revisiting this posting. I took information from all you guys to make my tester. Walt was right about not using a spring scale, mines went ka-pow ! there went my 20yr old Manley. I got the recommended from Walt a AWS TL-330 with its “peak hold” function. Works perfect.

I wrapped layers of spectra on the removable dowel on to a wall hook. Tied a Uni to Uni knot with a few wraps of test mono.


Brian
Really smart machine!
I can hardly believe, that your wall hook is just an off-the-shelf product.
It seems as if it was specially designed for this line testing purpose :-)
 
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zimezoom

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Hi all, I'm back to show you my testing jig.
I picked the winch idea from yessokk, but made my small version from a timber connector plate, a bolt and a crank handle of an old mincer.
The force gauge has nuts on the back side so it was easy to fix it on my shelf.

 
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