Indications of Intruders

lkatdpelicanfly

Lizard Fish Slayer
  • Jun 23, 2009
    2,704
    1,198
    Los Angeles
    Name
    Frank
    Boat
    no
    Hopefully JR gets a few big runs. Before knocked off to the point it's hard to tell the difference

    Sure has done allot of seed planting to have lunch stollen

    Strike while the iron is hot.

    Don't protect what is yours. Someone might come take it from you. Can't sue China. Or good luck trying
    Actually you can if they are selling in the US market..
     
    Upvote 0

    ZZZZZ

    I Post A Lot But I Can't Edit This
    Dec 11, 2003
    8,648
    11,492
    Costa Rica
    Name
    Brad Baron
    Boat
    Royal Polaris
    It definitely can be done. Good luck winning. Suing a China factory from the US.

    I should not had mentioned that
     
    Upvote 0

    Rodless_Jim

    I Post A Lot But I Can't Edit This
    Apr 3, 2008
    2,850
    2,076
    Mexico, DF, Mexico
    Name
    Jim
    Boat
    Strictly a Rider
    Probably going to regret taking the bait here (pun intended), but there is a pretty general misconception about how products "get knocked off" that very definitely applies to essentially counterfeit fishing tackle. There is also a perception that "it's all China."

    Neither of these ideas is anywhere close to being as true as people seem to think.

    First of all, not only is it virtually certain that some company will try to knock off any popular fishing lure, there are already simulations of the Intruder. The Intruder's natural defense is that a real model trolls really well, and gets bit extremely well too. Just having watched Jerry work on getting the lure dialed in, I know that it will be pretty damned hard for anyone to produce a quality knockoff, or sell it at a competitive price.

    Frankly, getting the right result to replicate hasn't been easy, which is what has been slowing down that production rollout.

    But if we're speaking in general terms, people seem to believe that it is the Chinese factories that produce fake lures (true) and sell them (false). Any number of companies, based anywhere from outside the US to inside the continental 48 (yes, usually overseas, but not always, and not always in Asia) may be responsible for the knockoffs, but you can be sure that the Chinese factory that produced the knockoffs aren't the responsible party. Yes, really.

    These factories are contract producers. They are hired by clients, and they make what their clients pay them to make. A very large part of that contract is that the client assumes responsibility for intellectual property rights. This is what makes it so hard to sue the factory and win. And the clients (big or small) are typically shell companies. They are the ones who are legally liable for copyright and/or patent infringement. Depending on where you file your suit, you may have trouble proving ownership of your intellectual property, but chances are you will have an even harder time finding the company you need to sue. They probably folded up their tent as soon as their shipments hit the US and started appearing in hardware stores. No assets? No judgement. You can win your suit. Heck, the company won't fight it. But you can't collect anything.

    Do the factories' owners know what they're doing? Of course they do, but that business culture is aggressively agnostic. They will build whatever you pay them to build. They won't even ask why you want it. And most of them will build to very high standards and tolerances...if you are willing to pay a premium. Having a long-standing relationship with the companies that own the factories helps with that.

    Maybe the part that most people don't realize is that not all of these factories are in China or even owned by Chinese nationals. Most are not. Besides, someone who really wants to knock off a fishing lure can easily (and legally) find a US-based agent to have it done. The company ripping off the design doesn't need to know any of the details. Pay the agent and tell them where you want to receive your shipment. For this to work, the company has to really trust the agent, but it can be done.

    And the manufacturing can take place in Indonesia or Malaysia, Mexico or Colombia, or yes, even China.

    Without going into any detail...and being honest, my understanding of the Intruder fabrication process is limited anyway...making this particular lure correctly is demanding. It doesn't easily lend itself to mass production. That, in fact, has been the real problem all along.

    Maybe in the meantime someone will build a better mousetrap. Hell, maybe someone already has. But as I understand it, the Intruder really IS a-coming. And I believe it will be worth the wait.
     
    jbarbosa
    jbarbosa
    Is Jerry from JRI and “Dr” Fauci related..? Asking for a friend.....
    Upvote 0

    Montaukmaniac

    Thats my son, not me.
    Feb 8, 2011
    941
    962
    Westchester NY
    Name
    Steve
    Boat
    miss ion/fish on, "Wish on"
    But as I understand it, the Intruder really IS a-coming. And I believe it will be worth the wait.

    "Waiting is the hardest part..."
     
    Upvote 0

    Intrepid Fan

    No Cal Lou
    Oct 1, 2009
    2,899
    2,395
    Green Valley, Az
    Name
    Lou Salatich
    Boat
    none
    Trying to figure out who has moved the goal posts more.....
    Fauci or Jerry with this “fake Intruder thing”.....Won’t be getting the vaccine OR this Intruder
    attempted re-tred.......Sticking with my original Intruders, Mag-Traks, and DTX’s....The window and my patience has long passed on both this lure and the fake disease....MAGA...!!!!!
    If Covid is fake what are all those people dieing from?
     
    Last edited:
    • Haha
    Reactions: JamesZ

    ZZZZZ

    I Post A Lot But I Can't Edit This
    Dec 11, 2003
    8,648
    11,492
    Costa Rica
    Name
    Brad Baron
    Boat
    Royal Polaris
    Probably going to regret taking the bait here (pun intended), but there is a pretty general misconception about how products "get knocked off" that very definitely applies to essentially counterfeit fishing tackle. There is also a perception that "it's all China."

    Neither of these ideas is anywhere close to being as true as people seem to think.

    First of all, not only is it virtually certain that some company will try to knock off any popular fishing lure, there are already simulations of the Intruder. The Intruder's natural defense is that a real model trolls really well, and gets bit extremely well too. Just having watched Jerry work on getting the lure dialed in, I know that it will be pretty damned hard for anyone to produce a quality knockoff, or sell it at a competitive price.

    Frankly, getting the right result to replicate hasn't been easy, which is what has been slowing down that production rollout.

    But if we're speaking in general terms, people seem to believe that it is the Chinese factories that produce fake lures (true) and sell them (false). Any number of companies, based anywhere from outside the US to inside the continental 48 (yes, usually overseas, but not always, and not always in Asia) may be responsible for the knockoffs, but you can be sure that the Chinese factory that produced the knockoffs aren't the responsible party. Yes, really.

    These factories are contract producers. They are hired by clients, and they make what their clients pay them to make. A very large part of that contract is that the client assumes responsibility for intellectual property rights. This is what makes it so hard to sue the factory and win. And the clients (big or small) are typically shell companies. They are the ones who are legally liable for copyright and/or patent infringement. Depending on where you file your suit, you may have trouble proving ownership of your intellectual property, but chances are you will have an even harder time finding the company you need to sue. They probably folded up their tent as soon as their shipments hit the US and started appearing in hardware stores. No assets? No judgement. You can win your suit. Heck, the company won't fight it. But you can't collect anything.

    Do the factories' owners know what they're doing? Of course they do, but that business culture is aggressively agnostic. They will build whatever you pay them to build. They won't even ask why you want it. And most of them will build to very high standards and tolerances...if you are willing to pay a premium. Having a long-standing relationship with the companies that own the factories helps with that.

    Maybe the part that most people don't realize is that not all of these factories are in China or even owned by Chinese nationals. Most are not. Besides, someone who really wants to knock off a fishing lure can easily (and legally) find a US-based agent to have it done. The company ripping off the design doesn't need to know any of the details. Pay the agent and tell them where you want to receive your shipment. For this to work, the company has to really trust the agent, but it can be done.

    And the manufacturing can take place in Indonesia or Malaysia, Mexico or Colombia, or yes, even China.

    Without going into any detail...and being honest, my understanding of the Intruder fabrication process is limited anyway...making this particular lure correctly is demanding. It doesn't easily lend itself to mass production. That, in fact, has been the real problem all along.

    Maybe in the meantime someone will build a better mousetrap. Hell, maybe someone already has. But as I understand it, the Intruder really IS a-coming. And I believe it will be worth the wait.

    Well said. I wish these jigs the best

    I should had never mentioned China.

    The Intruder. Is a niche LR market and not big enough of a interest and not a household product. For the big knock off factorys to knock off. Not enough volume

    Had a China factory manufacture our design. For a exclusive JC Penny Christmas model. We did all the product development and captured the account. Through trade shows and hard work. Sold close to 8 digits. In one Christmas order.

    Next year Christmas sales. JC penny buyer found our factory. Went around us. And used our user manual and warranty for the knock offs. Come Christmas day. Our customer service line. Was ringing off the hook. For product we didn't sell. Only developed and captured the account.
     
    Last edited:
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    Brad I

    Common Sense Isn't Common Enough
    Jun 20, 2015
    1,841
    2,391
    San Fernando Valley
    Name
    Brad I
    Boat
    Nope
    Well said. I wish these jigs the best

    I should had never mentioned China.

    The Intruder. Is a niche LR market and not big enough of a interest and not a household product. For the big knock off factorys to knock off. Not enough volume

    Had a China factory manufacture our design. For a exclusive JC Penny Christmas model. We did all the product development and captured the account. Through trade shows and hard work. Sold close to 8 digits. In one Christmas order.

    Next year Christmas sales. JC penny buyer found our factory. Went around us. And used our user manual and warranty for the knock offs. Come Christmas day. Our customer service line. Was ringing off the hook. For product we didn't sell. Only developed and captured the account.

    We had the same problem--people calling us to return product that we never had anything to do with, except someone knocked us off and used not only our name, but even heisted pictures from our website!

    A few people accused me of just trying to dodge responsibility, and a couple even gave me grief that we didn't have a toll free 800 number.

    Very frustrating, most of the knock-offs sold on Amazon.
     
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    Rubberhook2

    Local Bluefin
    Jan 19, 2007
    5,383
    1,524
    San Clemente
    Name
    Tim
    Boat
    None
    Lot's of options out there...

    Hooker 2 pic.JPG
    Hooker pic.JPG
    IMG_0191.JPG
    IMG_1932.JPG
     
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    ZZZZZ

    I Post A Lot But I Can't Edit This
    Dec 11, 2003
    8,648
    11,492
    Costa Rica
    Name
    Brad Baron
    Boat
    Royal Polaris
    We had the same problem--people calling us to return product that we never had anything to do with, except someone knocked us off and used not only our name, but even heisted pictures from our website!

    A few people accused me of just trying to dodge responsibility, and a couple even gave me grief that we didn't have a toll free 800 number.

    Very frustrating, most of the knock-offs sold on Amazon.

    Beyond frustrating. And we had a 800 line. Entire warranty and user manual and branded. Was in the box or on the box

    Bar none. The best desk stapler that I ever had. You sent me. So smooth with very little pressure needed to punch through multiple sheets :D I didn't know a normal looking stapler could do that. All about the components and the finer details of design. Haha it was blue color. Wonder where it is now?

    If it was that model. Sorry to hear. Kinda thought you were joking around with me. Until I received that stapler :)
     
    Upvote 0

    Brad I

    Common Sense Isn't Common Enough
    Jun 20, 2015
    1,841
    2,391
    San Fernando Valley
    Name
    Brad I
    Boat
    Nope
    Beyond frustrating. And we had a 800 line. Entire warranty and user manual and branded. Was in the box or on the box

    Bar none. The best desk stapler that I ever had. You sent me. So smooth with very little pressure needed to punch through multiple sheets :D I didn't know a normal looking stapler could do that. All about the components and the finer details of design. Haha it was blue color. Wonder where it is now?

    If it was that model. Sorry to hear. Kinda thought you were joking around with me. Until I received that stapler :)
    This time I was talking about the GatorGrip. Super frustrating, and Amazon was less than no help--they even threatened to drop us unless we lowered our prices to match the cheapo made in China knock-offs! (ours are USA made).

    The stapler was sold under the "PaperPro" brand and is still being sold, but mostly under the Bostich brand and is also private labelled. Its very different from old fashioned staplers, which are basically hammers--you slam down on the front and a metal tongue breaks off a staple and drives it through the paper. Our design uses a spring and as you press down, you depress the spring until you hit the release point, at which stage the spring releases its stored energy and that's what drives the metal tongue. That's why its smooth and easy and goes through 20 sheets as easily as it goes through 2.

    Our company doesn't actually make or sell anything; we invent and patent the inventions and license them to the actual manufacturers who pay us a royalty.

    Thanks for the kind words.
     
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    Tom Honaker

    I Should Upgrade My Account
    Sep 27, 2015
    1,326
    2,316
    63
    Hotchkiss Colorado
    Name
    Tom Honaker
    Boat
    Royal Star
    It's like Republican claims of Election Fraud, you will get to see it any day now.
    I have a line of flying pigs coming out any day now, it may take a little bit longer to get the manufacturing right! Plus it's really hard to get pigs flying correctly, lots of engineering involved, just be patient and any day now my flying pigs will be for sale, ( but don't tell anyone, the DTX minnows are more effective than my flying pigs) and you can actually buy one!!!
     
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    Fincutter

    Member
    Oct 3, 2016
    625
    634
    Bartlett, IL
    Name
    Greg
    Boat
    Excel
    I have no idea what happened with the Intruder but JRI is one of the best fishing tackle companies when it comes to reliably producing quality products. That's pretty amazing from a guy who has a regular job and does JRI as a side hustle. Yes, I'm a bit disappointed re the Intruder . . . but 2 of my top 3 jigs are JRIs (JRI 66 in blue/white, JRI 4 in mint/white/gold, along with Tady 14A in green sardine). Importantly, if I lose one of my favorite JRIs, I can easily replace it with another one that will be just as good. As such, my net feelings about JRI are abundantly favorable! Glass 99.9% full!
     
    Upvote 0

    caveman

    Almost A Member
    May 1, 2006
    148
    258
    windsor,ca
    Name
    charles boyd
    Boat
    20 ft. jetcraft,ciocc
    I was fortunate enough to get one of the Intruders available at the Fred Hall show a few years back. They had 10 each day for sale. My wife calls it the unicorn, as in they don’t exist. Hot pink like the one Rodless shows. It's been in the water 5 times, got bit every time. Feel lucky to have arrived at the show early enough to get one.
     
    Upvote 0

    Bill W

    tunaholic
  • Jan 12, 2006
    5,867
    8,942
    67
    Chino Hills, Ca.
    Name
    Bill Walsh
    Boat
    Red Rooster
    I am in this thought. There are only a portion of fish that are going to bite a lure, whatever that lure is. So you are not going to increase the boat score, but compete with the other trollers in your group. If no intruders in the mix, one lure will be the wahoo’s choice of the spread, no matter what that lure is. So… who cares if the intruder is not in the spread.
     
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