F#@%!!! Bull Shit Lobster Citation!!!

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ISLAND BOUND

I Should Upgrade My Account
Jan 18, 2006
1,989
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Look, technically if the gauge fits over the carapace tight it is 3.25" and it's legal. If he wants to be a jerk and measure them 3-4 times and wears down or breaks the carapace you are screwed.

All the guys I hoop with know that if the gauge goes over so does the bug, tough lesson.

Fight the ticket, explain yourself respectfully and I have a feeling you will be ok
 
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bparker1225

Ocean Addiction
Sep 27, 2004
1,917
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Bill Parker
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I always carefully reflect when when I take any action that might affect another person's livelihood.
That being said if I honestly believe that this warden was abusive and unprofessional, there is no excuse for such behavior!
P I would file a complaint( https://www.dfg.ca.gov/about/docs/FG-980CitizensReport.pdf). It might not be his first. Then I would determine if it was worth my time and resources to fight the ticket in court?
If I did fight it, I would file my complaint as well as the picture as exhibits. I also request, if allowable that his gauge and the lobster be provided as evidence. And I would ask for proof that this was "the lobster".
Good Luck
 
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lmd

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Aug 13, 2006
4
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Dan Cludy
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22 Baha Serena Sea
I think this is my second post ever, I enjoy reading the forums but never post. I've been fishing for lobster many years. The lobster is short!! There are no border line lobster. If the gauge fits over the shell throw it back. The shortest point on a lobster is the center of the eyes to the center of the shell. If the warden manipulated the gauge in any way or the gauge was not centered he would have gotten a false measurement in the fishermen's favor. If you felt like the warden had an attitude report him to the enforcement division of the DF&W. We don't need attitudes! Most of the time when I'm boarded the guys and gals are professional doing their jobs. Finally someone made the comment on the gauge. The gauge is made by an east coast company(not China) called Top-Me they come in stainless or Brass they are about $10 they won't bend like the cheap aluminum ones and in fact as someone said this gauge benefits the fishermen because it is a little wider. The last time I ordered a gauge The phone number was (207) 729-6676 they sell a few other items that might be of some help in the recreational fishing. Good fishing to you guys see ya on the water.
 
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  • Jul 30, 2008
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    Rob
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    Look, technically if the gauge fits over the carapace tight it is 3.25" and it's legal. If he wants to be a jerk and measure them 3-4 times and wears down or breaks the carapace you are screwed.

    All the guys I hoop with know that if the gauge goes over so does the bug, tough lesson.

    Fight the ticket, explain yourself respectfully and I have a feeling you will be ok
    I always carefully reflect when when I take any action that might affect another person's livelihood.
    That being said if I honestly believe that this warden was abusive and unprofessional, there is no excuse for such behavior!
    P I would file a complaint( https://www.dfg.ca.gov/about/docs/FG-980CitizensReport.pdf). It might not be his first. Then I would determine if it was worth my time and resources to fight the ticket in court?
    If I did fight it, I would file my complaint as well as the picture as exhibits. I also request, if allowable that his gauge and the lobster be provided as evidence. And I would ask for proof that this was "the lobster".
    Good Luck


    As I said earlier, he put my bug in a cooler that had three other bugs in it. Not sure what he did with it? He never released it while I was present.
     
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    sctransplant

    Newbie
    Dec 9, 2007
    6
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    Tierrasanta
    Name
    Pat
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    58 foot Blancherd
    I went through the same crap last year . Some of the wardens they have posted up on opening night are not used to dealing with lobster and they seem like they are looking to try and make as many citations as possible to make funding for next years programs. We just went to night court and paid $200 to get it over with . Not worth all the trouble just make dam sure they are above legal unless you want to make more donations to Fish and Wildlife .
     
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  • Jul 30, 2008
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    That thing is way short, no wonder he was an asshole listening to your BS.


    "Way short" you say? Listening to my BS you say?

    The pic I posted was not the best evidence but it was not short! It was a legal bug and that is that!

    You were not there and had no idea what my attitude was like. I didn't agree with him and he got an attitude. This is my thread and my side of the story and yes the warden has his.
     
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    makairaa

    I Post A Lot But I Can't Edit This
    May 1, 2005
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    I always carefully reflect when when I take any action that might affect another person's livelihood.
    That being said if I honestly believe that this warden was abusive and unprofessional, there is no excuse for such behavior!
    P I would file a complaint( https://www.dfg.ca.gov/about/docs/FG-980CitizensReport.pdf). It might not be his first. Then I would determine if it was worth my time and resources to fight the ticket in court?
    If I did fight it, I would file my complaint as well as the picture as exhibits. I also request, if allowable that his gauge and the lobster be provided as evidence. And I would ask for proof that this was "the lobster".
    Good Luck

    If the incident actually occurred as the op wrote it he antagonized the officer, of course the officer cut him no slack. Read the post. The officer asks "who measured this lobster?" The op answered "I did". The officer responds "I believe it is short". As soon as he said believe that tells me that if the op had been nice it probably would have been a warning. Instead he replies "no it is not". He even admits he was challenging the officer. No form of law enforcement officer likes to be told he is wrong by someone who is breaking the law. Moral of the story is treat someone with disrespect, they will disrespect you back.
     
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    ISLAND BOUND

    I Should Upgrade My Account
    Jan 18, 2006
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    This is what probably happened to the 3 bugs in the cooler

    image.jpg
     
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    InRodWeTrust

    Too blessed 2 be stressed
    Mar 8, 2013
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    Wes
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    He even admits he was challenging the officer. No form of law enforcement officer likes to be told he is wrong by someone who is breaking the law. Moral of the story is treat someone with disrespect, they will disrespect you back.

    What's wrong with challenging an officer if you believe you are right?

    I'm not saying we should be belligerent assholes, after all the warden is just doing his job, but if you are in the right rolling over and not standing up for yourself only gives the bad apples in law enforcement more power over you/us.

    If you feel you are right don' be intimidated by a badge and threat of a fine. Any LEO it's just as capable of making a mistake as we are.

    That badge isn't a symbol of ownership of us. It's a symbol of a level of authority they've been entrusted not to abuse. How many legitimate examples are out there of cops/game wardens being proved wrong but won't back down and admit a mistake for fear of looking weak?

    I've known Rob for many years.
    I've fished, hooped and shared a beer with him many times and can tell you his integrity is not questionable.
    Is it possible he made a mistake measuring that bug?...it's possible.
    Is it possible the warden made a mistake and is just a dick that didn't want to admit it? ...it's possible.

    ...ok this rant has gone on long enough.
    Moral of the story is its ok to disagree and challenge authority.
     
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    yellowklr

    My Best Catch!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Sep 22, 2003
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    If you fight it... and they don't dismiss or lessen penalty on the first day, you might be looking at 5 to 6 separate court appearances = 5-6 days off work/vacation time burned... but note, not only are you looking at a Large Fine... you are also looking at a Misdemeanor on your record. If you don't have a job, good luck finding one... Or two more "strikes" and you are out. IMO, Fishing Violations like this should be an "Infraction" (fix it ticket/toss it back), not "Misdemeanor" (Hard Core Criminal) e.g. DUI, Shop Lifting, etc. If you had a Cooler Full of Shorts, then that's a different story...


    First the ticket is filed as an infraction and second it requires only two court appearances
    Arraignment and the trial
     
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    Paddyman1

    I think this is my second post ever, I enjoy reading the forums but never post. I've been fishing for lobster many years. The lobster is short!! There are no border line lobster. If the gauge fits over the shell throw it back. The shortest point on a lobster is the center of the eyes to the center of the shell. If the warden manipulated the gauge in any way or the gauge was not centered he would have gotten a false measurement in the fishermen's favor. If you felt like the warden had an attitude report him to the enforcement division of the DF&W. We don't need attitudes! Most of the time when I'm boarded the guys and gals are professional doing their jobs. Finally someone made the comment on the gauge. The gauge is made by an east coast company(not China) called Top-Me they come in stainless or Brass they are about $10 they won't bend like the cheap aluminum ones and in fact as someone said this gauge benefits the fishermen because it is a little wider. The last time I ordered a gauge The phone number was (207) 729-6676 they sell a few other items that might be of some help in the recreational fishing. Good fishing to you guys see ya on the water.
    It's actually your 4th post ever.:Smoke_Emoticon: But you made some sense. DFG can be unpredictable.
     
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    inbx3

    Newbie
    Mar 30, 2006
    45
    0
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    Name
    Roy
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    none
    I heard that the bug has to measure legal on DFG's gauge, so if theirs is "long" then you're bummed. If it's close it goes back. Good luck with the rest of your season.
     
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    gonzo25

    GOT A BIG ONE
  • Nov 20, 2008
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    george
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    "Way short" you say? Listing to my BS you say?

    The pic I posted was not the best evidence but it was not short! It was a legal bug and that is that!

    You were not there and had no idea what my attitude was like. I didn't agree with him and he got an attitude. This is my thread and my side of the story and yes the warden has his.

    Rob... it's your thread and you side of the story, but didn't you post it to get othets opinion, or did you just want the opinions of those who agree with you,... you should state that up front if that is the case. Look dude I feel your pain... it seems you are asking for others opinion and i am going to give you mine and it will be what i truely think, or don't ask.

    to me it looked short in the picture and I wouldn't be using that for evidence, but i wasn't there to see it measured. you may not think you had any attitude, but maybe you did or maybe you just didn't choose your words as well as you could have.. this guy may have just had to deal with some real assholes and didn't have any patience or was a little to quick to flex his authoritative muscle... these are all possible and all things none of us got to hear for our selves. i think you probably could have chosen different wording or a different approach that wouldn't have put this guy in a defensive attitude. just food for thought, you may want to think about it.. you may want to mention it to the judge in court, that you didn't mean to but maybe you didn't come off... however. if you want to come out ahead, remember who is in control like it or not and you have to be diplomatic and humble IF your going to come out ahead. if it were me, when he said he thought it might be short, my response would have been, i measured it a couple of times, maybe i am doing it wrong... can you show me how you are doing it? i know how to measure them, but to let them feel like they are king shit is only going to work in your favor... unless not knowing when to not act like i normally do is all you are concerned with...

    If it were me i would be fighting it. i would feel that i measured it correctly and i would be going to the mat in my own defense. how they can convict you without the evidence to show you were guilty or for you to prove you are innocent blows me away, and i would be making a big deal about that... in a nice way, but firmly.

    don't expect to win, you have nothing to loose and you may get less of a fine if you handle yourself the right way. if this is like traffic court you won't be going in front of a judge, who is an elected official, you will be going in front of an arbatrador... just something else to keep in mind. sorry this happened to you and good luck/
     
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  • Jul 30, 2008
    2,499
    456
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    Name
    Rob
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    Luhrs Tournament series
    Rob... it's your thread and you side of the story, but didn't you post it to get othets opinion, or did you just want the opinions of those who agree with you,... you should state that up front if that is the case. Look dude I feel your pain... it seems you are asking for others opinion and i am going to give you mine and it will be what i truely think, or don't ask.

    to me it looked short in the picture and I wouldn't be using that for evidence, but i wasn't there to see it measured. you may not think you had any attitude, but maybe you did or maybe you just didn't choose your words as well as you could have.. this guy may have just had to deal with some real assholes and didn't have any patience or was a little to quick to flex his authoritative muscle... these are all possible and all things none of us got to hear for our selves. i think you probably could have chosen different wording or a different approach that wouldn't have put this guy in a defensive attitude. just food for thought, you may want to think about it.. you may want to mention it to the judge in court, that you didn't mean to but maybe you didn't come off... however. if you want to come out ahead, remember who is in control like it or not and you have to be diplomatic and humble IF your going to come out ahead. if it were me, when he said he thought it might be short, my response would have been, i measured it a couple of times, maybe i am doing it wrong... can you show me how you are doing it? i know how to measure them, but to let them feel like they are king shit is only going to work in your favor... unless not knowing when to not act like i normally do is all you are concerned with...

    If it were me i would be fighting it. i would feel that i measured it correctly and i would be going to the mat in my own defense. how they can convict you without the evidence to show you were guilty or for you to prove you are innocent blows me away, and i would be making a big deal about that... in a nice way, but firmly.

    don't expect to win, you have nothing to loose and you may get less of a fine if you handle yourself the right way. if this is like traffic court you won't be going in front of a judge, who is an elected official, you will be going in front of an arbatrador... just something else to keep in mind. sorry this happened to you and good luck/


    Your post is fair and neutral. I will just pay the fine and be more careful next time. If I find myself in this situation again, I will take this advice and other positive advice from other posters. Thanks!
     
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    if1sh

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    Nov 8, 2010
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    Damn sucks. But lesson learned. Don't piss off the wardens. Most are really just are doing their jobs. You can imagine how many poachers are out there. By giving him an attitude... He might just think you're just another poacher.

    Short or not... You probably shouldn't have kept it. It was just too close. I would never keep a bare 14 inch bass.... Or barely 22 inch Hali... Or barely 28 inch white sea-bass....... And so on. Not worth it at all.
     
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    titos334

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    Aug 19, 2012
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    Your post is fair and neutral. I will just pay the fine and be more careful next time. If I find myself in this situation again, I will take this advice and other positive advice from other posters. Thanks!

    If you give in and pay the fine now, don't expect to be able to fight it in the future. If you want to keep measuring the way you do you, you should fight it.
     
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    a238killfish

    killfish
    Feb 22, 2008
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    dan
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    Challenging an officer??? In front of your kid??? No way to bend that into anything cool.
    telling any person up to the president of the united states that you disagree with them is your right under the constitution. there is no marshall law in effect. I had gotten a speeding ticket once and told officer he was mistaken and in court I was right and right and he was wrong. doesn't mean I have less respect for him. holding this guy in judgment for doing something like this is out of line in my opinion courtesy of the first amendment.
     
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    sickcat

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    Aug 5, 2003
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    What's wrong with challenging an officer if you believe you are right?

    I'm not saying we should be belligerent assholes, after all the warden is just doing his job, but if you are in the right rolling over and not standing up for yourself only gives the bad apples in law enforcement more power over you/us.

    If you feel you are right don' be intimidated by a badge and threat of a fine. Any LEO it's just as capable of making a mistake as we are.

    That badge isn't a symbol of ownership of us. It's a symbol of a level of authority they've been entrusted not to abuse. How many legitimate examples are out there of cops/game wardens being proved wrong but won't back down and admit a mistake for fear of looking weak?

    I've known Rob for many years.
    I've fished, hooped and shared a beer with him many times and can tell you his integrity is not questionable.
    Is it possible he made a mistake measuring that bug?...it's possible.
    Is it possible the warden made a mistake and is just a dick that didn't want to admit it? ...it's possible.

    ...ok this rant has gone on long enough.
    Moral of the story is its ok to disagree and challenge authority.

    If you believe your right challenging the officer is good thing to do. You do it in court in front of a judge - not n the street.
     
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    lobzila

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    I don't know you, or even pretend to know what happened that night at the ramp. But in the picture you posted, the gauge falls over the carapace of the lobster, and that makes it short. The gauges DFG uses are high end gauges that are certified to be 3.25". If you are showing that picture as evidence, the Warden also has pictures of it as well and probably shows more and better angles to show it was short. It was a long night for the DFG on the opener. Pretty much half the states agents get called off there regular posts and are sent to check every diver and hooper they can find. Normally I get checked three to four times a season and always get checked on opening night. Sometimes more than once. Only time I had a problem was with a Oceanside Harbor Policeperson who did not know how to measure it and I tried to show her the correct way, but her response was, Fish and Game instructed us to measure them this way, and then let the lobster go, no picture, nada, zip. I made a joke about the old man with his bucket full of pet fish who he takes for a swim everyday about letting the bug go in front of her co-workers who laughed at my humor which just pissed her off even more and she wrote a ticket. I learned that night to never embarrass a female law enforcement officer in front of her peers, even if she deserves it.
    Sorry, but in the picture you posted, you made a mistake measuring it. Everyone makes mistakes. How you react to mistakes is how your character is judged. Good luck.
     
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