CUSTOM ROD DEVIATION FROM FACTORY LAYOUTS Basics

Discussion in 'Fishing Rod Building Forum' started by geebee, Mar 14, 2018.

  1. geebee

    geebee My Member is Well-Known

    Location:
    San Diego
    Name:
    Gee Bee
    Boat:
    Partial to AZTEC - aspiring to INTREPID
    • Messages:
      (719)
    • Likes Received:
      (270)
    ORDERING CUSTOM RODS Vs FACTORY RODS - Measurements

    I'm trying to understand the basics of how placements of custom rod components laid out by experts during a 'fitting' typically differ from factory rods. I am mostly interested in saltwater rods used in San Diego fleet like a 196 blank to XXH (with non-roller guides because laying them out complicates my question).

    BUYING A USED CUSTOM SALTWATER FISHING ROD

    It seems a buyer should be careful and be aware of how custom rods can differ from factory rods if he is buying used professionally-built custom rod because a custom fishing pole was most likely tailored to the person who purchased the rod - correct?

    My instinct is that determining the correct position for the REEL SEAT is the most critical first move - correct?

    I reason this because the 1st guide (closest to the reel) will start the sequence (spacing of guides) to the tip, and those don't change much and can be found on manufacturer's guide charts - correct?

    When I built my rods some 20 years ago, before youtube and the internet were as populated with info, I based my placements on measuring factory rods, but I'm about to start on a new calstar XH blank so I am trying to improve my layout a little (or at least keep it generic to factory specs).

    ROD BUILDING CLASSES:

    I've noted in reading this forum there are rod-building seminars and classes available, but I don't have time for that and I'm hoping someone can shed some light on my questions without recommending me to classes.

    Meanwhile I will continue looking for useful online tutorials and videos that don't get too deep or broad.
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2018
  2. gecsr1

    gecsr1 28' Aquasport "Reel Adventure II"

    Location:
    Poway Ca
    Name:
    Gary
    Boat:
    28' Aquasport "Reel Adventure II" / PlainJaneRods
    • Messages:
      (11,903)
    • Likes Received:
      (2,575)
    well you don't have time to go to a rod class and get all the answers that you are seeking ????WOW...but you expect others here to spend their time explaining it all to you.....MMMMMMMMM interesting... have a wonderful day....and good luck...
     
    rodblder likes this.
  3. skrilla

    skrilla allirks

    Location:
    San Diego
    Name:
    Len
    Boat:
    plastic fantastic
    • Messages:
      (1,527)
    • Likes Received:
      (1,133)

    Yup.

    Yup.

    Stripper guide ( biggest guide closest to the reel ) is postioned based on the reel height, width, and where you will be mounting it.

    Spacing and sizing of the reduction and runner guides are determined by the bend of the blank. Adjust accordingly. Manufacturer "charts", although useful, are mostly a starting guide. In my humble opinion they are absolutely irrelevant.

    Becareful with factory specs. There is no standard. Some lower end models may use insufficient number of guides or smaller than usual sizes to keep the costs down. Older models may use a guide spacing template based on older taller reels. Also noticed some factory spacing look great when bent under 45 degrees. But when you fully load closer to a 90 degree bend you have line touching the blank and sharp line angles all over the place.

    The classes are very casual. Some guys only show up for an hour. Some stay all night. It is a very unique opportunity and as a custom builder you owe it to yourself to make it out at least once. Especially with something as visual as guide train layout. Last year a couple of the guys were oogling over a couple rods I built for the Fred Hall show. This year I found myself oogling over their work. Amazing how fast guys have gotten good in under a year. I blame our instructors mostly.
     
    Olddog8, ChuyG, Team Sency and 7 others like this.
  4. cmepen

    cmepen I've posted enough I should edit this section

    Location:
    Chula Vista
    Name:
    Einar Lohner
    Boat:
    Cabo Marine 226
    • Messages:
      (3,771)
    • Likes Received:
      (1,428)
    X2 on what Len said. Incredible, FREE, opportunity for guidance on building a rod. There are several builders who travel from Long Beach,Temecula, LA.... I have been going for more than five years and continue to learn from the expertise of the mentors there.
     
    DocSki, ChuyG, Gabe L. and 2 others like this.
  5. geebee

    geebee My Member is Well-Known

    Location:
    San Diego
    Name:
    Gee Bee
    Boat:
    Partial to AZTEC - aspiring to INTREPID
    • Messages:
      (719)
    • Likes Received:
      (270)
    skrilla,

    Wow your introduction of rod-building terminology (and professional insights) are off-the-charts helpful, thank you so much!

    If there are any basic points about how to 'read' a rod that has already been built, it would be useful to me and I'm sure others who may stumble onto this post.
     
  6. geebee

    geebee My Member is Well-Known

    Location:
    San Diego
    Name:
    Gee Bee
    Boat:
    Partial to AZTEC - aspiring to INTREPID
    • Messages:
      (719)
    • Likes Received:
      (270)
    Gary,

    I genuinely do not get the negative tone in your Reply.

    I, too, have many thousands of posts on a couple professional forums in my areas of expertise to freely share my knowledge and valuable time with those trying to learn something.

    But thank you for wishing me a good day (it's my Friday so you can bet I will), and for your expression of good luck in finding the knowledge I humbly seek here to build my new fishing rod.
     
    Cubeye and makairaa like this.
  7. gecsr1

    gecsr1 28' Aquasport "Reel Adventure II"

    Location:
    Poway Ca
    Name:
    Gary
    Boat:
    28' Aquasport "Reel Adventure II" / PlainJaneRods
    • Messages:
      (11,903)
    • Likes Received:
      (2,575)
    again have a great day, you really should go to the rod class...and learn what works for you... what works for one does not work for another...
     
  8. geebee

    geebee My Member is Well-Known

    Location:
    San Diego
    Name:
    Gee Bee
    Boat:
    Partial to AZTEC - aspiring to INTREPID
    • Messages:
      (719)
    • Likes Received:
      (270)
    HERE ARE THE FACTORY MEASUREMENTS for Calstar Grafighter GF700XH

    Fisherman's Landing tackle had it in stock and didn't mind if I measured it out.

    Calstar700XH.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2018
  9. Pinche Whetto

    Pinche Whetto Newbie

    Location:
    San Diego
    Name:
    Mike Myers
    Boat:
    Anyone's who'll take me.
    • Messages:
      (60)
    • Likes Received:
      (35)
    Learn to static test, you're over complicating it. Put in the time, go to the class, and you'll be less likely to fuck it up. Then the vibe is comically hostile.
     
  10. Day0ne

    Day0ne Well-Known "Member"

    Location:
    Texas
    Name:
    David
    Boat:
    233 Formula Shadowdancer
    • Messages:
      (888)
    • Likes Received:
      (313)


    Factory rods are mass produced and everything is the same. Not all blanks of the same model will be the same or bend exactly the same. Part of the custom work is fitting the components to their proper place on the blank by static testing. Part of the custom work is the colors and decorations that suit the buyer. Part of the custom work is having the exact components the customer desires.




    Maybe, maybe not. In my opinion, the only part of the "custom" work that may be tailored to an individual is reel seat placement and butt length, and that can be common to many people. You seem to be under the impression that rods are "fitted" to an individual like a suit. I've ordered rods from CA and I live in TX and all I had to do was give my preferred butt length and reel seat placement (I like my reel seats down locking), decorations and colors, component choices, and presto, a custom rod was born. I've been happy with all of them. It's using a builder you trust and does work you like.
     
    geebee and Cubeye like this.
  11. Cubeye

    Cubeye I've posted enough I should edit this section

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Name:
    Kub
    Boat:
    17' Gregor
    • Messages:
      (2,563)
    • Likes Received:
      (1,544)
    I agree. People come on these sites to learn from others, get different opinions, and to seek accurate information and not get bashed. I see no constructive reason for statements like that.

    Oh, and geebee, others learn from the positive posts on this thread. Not just you.
     
    geebee likes this.
  12. gecsr1

    gecsr1 28' Aquasport "Reel Adventure II"

    Location:
    Poway Ca
    Name:
    Gary
    Boat:
    28' Aquasport "Reel Adventure II" / PlainJaneRods
    • Messages:
      (11,903)
    • Likes Received:
      (2,575)
    It's good you share your opinion as I did mine.
    have a good day :),
     
  13. geebee

    geebee My Member is Well-Known

    Location:
    San Diego
    Name:
    Gee Bee
    Boat:
    Partial to AZTEC - aspiring to INTREPID
    • Messages:
      (719)
    • Likes Received:
      (270)
    Lots of good, useful information in that post. The 'fitting' seems mostly limited to reel seat placement and then ensuring all the components work around it?

    If correct, that makes me feel a lot better about buying used custom rods as long as I keep an eye out on reel seat position.
     
  14. geebee

    geebee My Member is Well-Known

    Location:
    San Diego
    Name:
    Gee Bee
    Boat:
    Partial to AZTEC - aspiring to INTREPID
    • Messages:
      (719)
    • Likes Received:
      (270)
    Yes! Amen.
     
  15. Cubeye

    Cubeye I've posted enough I should edit this section

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Name:
    Kub
    Boat:
    17' Gregor
    • Messages:
      (2,563)
    • Likes Received:
      (1,544)
    "have a good day".............Sarcasm? Are you a retired Cop? Isn't that what they say after giving you a ticket? Maybe a Want-A-Be cop?
     
  16. gecsr1

    gecsr1 28' Aquasport "Reel Adventure II"

    Location:
    Poway Ca
    Name:
    Gary
    Boat:
    28' Aquasport "Reel Adventure II" / PlainJaneRods
    • Messages:
      (11,903)
    • Likes Received:
      (2,575)
    your as funny as a 3 dollar bill ... i take back you having a nice day... LMAO....:)
     
  17. Orca

    Orca シャチ, 鯱

    Location:
    Mira Mesa Ca
    Name:
    Don
    Boat:
    2359 Trophy, Irene Sea
    • Messages:
      (3,473)
    • Likes Received:
      (117)
    must have heard of my bubbling personality :D
     
  18. 8 Week Wonder

    8 Week Wonder The Backward Wrapper

    Location:
    Rancho Bernardo
    Name:
    Steve Tomiyama
    Boat:
    nada
    • Messages:
      (697)
    • Likes Received:
      (312)
    ".......In my opinion, the only part of the "custom" work that may be tailored to an individual is reel seat placement and butt length, and that can be common to many people."

    There are other things on a custom rod that can be tailored to the individual. The types of components used such as an Aluminum or graphite reel seat or no reel seat; boat guides (braced or unbraced), compared to the many styles of Fuji, insert type guides, even the type of inserts in the guides can be customized.

    The type of grips are idividualized. Depending on the use of the rod.or the fisherman's preference, they can be Hypalon, EVA, Cork, cord, or Cork tape, in whole or in combination.

    Guide placement can be a little different., as Len said earlier, each blank is unique. What also affects guide placement is the number and size of the guides used. As an example, if 9 guides are used, a rod builder could use sizes 8, 8, 8,10, 10,10,12, 14, 20 or 8, 8, 8, 8, 10,10, 12,14, 20. Just by exchanging a size 10 for an 8 can affect guide placement. Just imagine the difference if a size 25 is used as the stripper guide.

    These are all some of the things that a rod builder takes into accont to make a custom rod for you. Its more than the extraordinary art work you see posted here that maks a great rod.
     
    Orca, ChuyG, JTrelikes and 4 others like this.
  19. Capt Richie

    Capt Richie Atlantic Custom Tackle

    Location:
    nassau NY
    Name:
    Richie
    Boat:
    32 albe
    • Messages:
      (3,853)
    • Likes Received:
      (385)
    Your missing the point of custom...First off using a blank that not factory built..But designed for the type of fishing the angler is doing...(Custom designed blanks) ...

    Rod balance for the angler ..guide train not a standard MN type but a well thought out guide train...Thread & epoxy work ..Grips that give the angler comfort and control ...

    all a fishing rod is ,is a tool to catch fish and the better the tool ...If all you think a custom rod is , is reel seat placement dont buy one...stay with factory wrapped rods..
     
  20. geebee

    geebee My Member is Well-Known

    Location:
    San Diego
    Name:
    Gee Bee
    Boat:
    Partial to AZTEC - aspiring to INTREPID
    • Messages:
      (719)
    • Likes Received:
      (270)
    Yea, that's why I'm here.

    I'm not so quick to throw in the towel on my custom rod projects - to stay with factory rods - with all the knowledge available in this rod-building community to keep me on track.

    FINE ART Vs Functional Rod Building

    But it seems custom rod building can mean different things to different people depending if they have the budget (or tastes) for levels of fine art custom work, hiring basic professional competence, or just want a do-it-yourself DIY project for hobbyists and enthusiasts.

    My hunt for a 60-80lb standup/rail tuna rod has brought me to DIY for several reasons, including my limited budget, matching the colors of my other DIY rods, and the enjoyment I get from researching and building my own tools.
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2018

Share This Page