Brand New Trailer and a Problem Already!

Discussion in 'Washington Fishing Reports' started by wood2turn, Sep 18, 2016.

  1. wood2turn

    wood2turn Well-Known "Member"

    Location:
    Oak Harbor, WA
    Name:
    Terry
    Boat:
    14’ Sterling Sea Skiff - Gypsy Queen
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    Unbelievable....

    Buy the trailer in July 2016. Use it 4 times (Saltwater).
    Wash it after every dunk.
    Now I move it out of the barn to clean up the boat (and my shop...which needed it far worse than the boat ever has), and when backing the right brake caliper just locks up. I can drive forward and it will drag for a bit but I cannot back up. Well actually it will back up going downhill but into the garage is slightly uphill and that just is not happening.

    These are disk Surge Brakes.
    I emailed the company and will hope their customer service as as good (or better) as I have heard and will get an answer quick.

    I can't take it back to the place of purchase because of the dragging brake. Figuring it may overheat the bearings in that 40 mile trip at hwy speeds and cause more damage or leaving me stranded on the side of the road.

    It was a little bit low on fluid and I did notice some seepage from the lower bleed valve. Maybe it was just low on fluid? If there is air in the lines....how does a body bleed a surge brake system properly?

    Looking to the experienced "brain trust" for help on this.
    Hoping for a quick and easy fix...
     
  2. tacklejacked

    tacklejacked Capt./ Ho if I get to drive

    Location:
    Seabeck
    Name:
    Greg
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    22 Hewescraft Searunner ET HT
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    You've got air holding the caliper. Or the plunger is stuck in. Bleeding is a two person job on those. Surge brakes take a lot of maintenance. Make sure when the trailer gets parked the cylinder pushes the trailer coupler all the way forward. Sometimes when you back em up they don't reset all the way when you park it.
     
  3. tacklejacked

    tacklejacked Capt./ Ho if I get to drive

    Location:
    Seabeck
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    Greg
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    Also there is a lock out on those for backing and a key provided to hold the lockout. Assuming its an ezloader. If you don't plug the wiring harness in you can't back it without locking it out.
     
  4. Clockwork

    Clockwork I've posted enough I should edit this section

    Location:
    covington, wa
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    Ryan
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    It's a surge actuated brake. Therefore you can't back up a hill unless you either mechanically or electrically lockout the actuator. When you back up a hill the weight of the boat compresses the cylinder, locking up the brakes. When you back down a hill the weight of the boat pulls and extends the cylinder releasing pressure. When you drive forward it will drag a little until the cylinder is released.

    Standard surge brake bullshit.
     
  5. G-Spot

    G-Spot Captain

    Location:
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    John
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    Clockwork nailed it... the problem is
    Not the trailer, it is you and your lack of understanding how surge brakes work. When your trailer "surges" forward it causes the brakes to come on. Backing up is the same reaction, since you are pushing against the surge actuator, you are basically pushing the brakes pedal on your trailer.

    As mentioned above lock out the surge actuator when backing up. Many trailers have this feature.
     
  6. WaveDancer

    WaveDancer Fishing The Pacific Ocean & Puget Sound Since 1969

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    Kitsap/Westport, WA
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    Ken
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    The OP mentioned calipers so i assume it has disc brakes on it.

    With this in mind the system should have a reverse lockout solonoid in the brake line right behind the master cylinder.

    Assuming it does there is either a wiring problem or a problem with the solonoid.

    If you have a four flat wiring connector on the tow vehicle, start here, it should be a five flat or five or seven round connector.

    WD.
     
    Grady226 and lucerunner like this.
  7. wood2turn

    wood2turn Well-Known "Member"

    Location:
    Oak Harbor, WA
    Name:
    Terry
    Boat:
    14’ Sterling Sea Skiff - Gypsy Queen
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    I will look again but I am sure the wiring is a flat 4-pin. If it is a 5-pin then yes....I have it wired wrong and will have to figure out where that #5 pin should connect to on my trucks 7-pin round. (I am using an adapter).

    If that's not the problem I will look for air in the system.
    In either case....why would it effect only the right side?

    Oh....the trailer is a Road Runner brand.
     
  8. “biteme”

    “biteme” Killin kings

    Location:
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    A 2 by 4 will wedge nicely in the surge coupler opening, jam it in there to prevent movement and back up the hill. I can snap a pic of the maneuver if needed.


    I wont have to mess with this monkey business when very shortly i convert to eoh
     
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  9. ledbed6b

    ledbed6b I've posted enough I should edit this section

    Location:
    Shoreline WA
    Name:
    Eli
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    Parker 2320
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    The 5th pin goes to the reverse light. So it sounds like user error if you only have a 4pin.
     
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  10. Flying Arima

    Flying Arima Member

    Location:
    wa
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    James
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    sold
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    on most trailers the 5th pin everyone is talking about is a blue wire. My trailer has a flat 5 and also has a manual override on top of the solenoid to back up in the event the electrical fails.
     
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  11. WA dux

    WA dux Newbie

    Location:
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    If it was the eletrical reverse lockout causing this, wouldnt both right and left calipers lockup? He said one side is locking up
     
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  12. 4v1df12h1ng

    4v1df12h1ng Sensei

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    Who
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    W/O reading everyone's responses. Make sure your truck reverse wire (When truck in reverse output +12dc) is connected to your trailer blue wire (reverse wire) which actuate a solenoid to open/bypass and release hydraulic pressure to brakes while backing up to prevent braking. Backing up in a incline will put more pressure on master cylinder causing harding to back up. If your trailer has this reverse solenoid you should be using a 5 pin connector not 4. Truck Factory installed hitches has the round 7 pin connector attached to factory hitch. Buy yourself an adapter from Walmart or auto store a 7 to 5 pin blade/flat adapter..
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2016
  13. Clockwork

    Clockwork I've posted enough I should edit this section

    Location:
    covington, wa
    Name:
    Ryan
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    GW Marlin
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    Let's start with setting up and operating the trailer properly and go from there.
     
    ledbed6b, Bellboy17 and Admin Leave like this.
  14. TexMojoII

    TexMojoII Well, Shit!

    Location:
    Lacey, Washington
    Name:
    Larry
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    Parker 2820
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    I've seen mechanics use a large c clamp on the actuator to prevent the brakes from locking up when trying to back trailers, but if you have 4 pin, then thats probably the culprit. Good Luck
     
  15. Carpfisher

    Carpfisher Chief Cook & Bottle Washer

    Location:
    Carpinteria
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    Paul
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    If only one caliper is locked up, its probably not the master/actuater assy.
    try cracking the bleeder screw to see if it frees up.if not then it's possibly a stuck piston of frozen/binding sliders. If it's a GM type with a 5/16 allen, pull the pins, make sure the little metal bushing on the big end that the pin goes thru moves freely in it's bushing, pin goes thru small bushing on other end.lube all and reassemble. If you suspect stuck piston pull off hose and plug with a long tire valve stem, take to brake guy that can rebuild them, kits are cheap and easy to do IF you know what your doing. 10 minutes, I wouldn't even change a boat guy that brought me one...oh yeah, if cracking the bleeder frees it, replace the brake line.
     
  16. ledbed6b

    ledbed6b I've posted enough I should edit this section

    Location:
    Shoreline WA
    Name:
    Eli
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    Parker 2320
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    I'll bet a beer that getting the correct plug setup fixes the issue. No need to troubleshoot issues that aren't there
     
  17. wdlfbio

    wdlfbio Once you go Cat, you never go back

    Location:
    maple valley, wa
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    laurence
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    Op never said anything about electric over hydraulic, so the blue wire is just a guess. So, I'm guessing he didn't lock the surge coupler and that's preventing him from backing up. Further, the LEFT brake is probably bad, because it SHOULD BE locking. The RIGHT brake is doing what it is supposed to.

    My lockout takes a 4" bolt through the coupler.
     
  18. wood2turn

    wood2turn Well-Known "Member"

    Location:
    Oak Harbor, WA
    Name:
    Terry
    Boat:
    14’ Sterling Sea Skiff - Gypsy Queen
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    Would a picture help?
    I can get one tomorrow.

    Just went and verified that it is a flat 5-pin and I am using an adapter to a 7-pin round connector on the truck.

    It appears that I may have pinched a wire when I rerouted the wires to keep them from dragging on the ground. I'll have to remove the loom tomorrow and verify that but...what Larry said about that break assembly working properly seems to make some sense.
    Regardless I will verify that I have the adapter wired properly with the truck. Blue wire might be going to the wrong pin on the truck?
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2016
  19. WaveDancer

    WaveDancer Fishing The Pacific Ocean & Puget Sound Since 1969

    Location:
    Kitsap/Westport, WA
    Name:
    Ken
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    I have never seen a SURGE disc brake trailer that did "not" have a reverse lockout solenoid if it was built correctly, and that would require a five wire connector that has a circuit for the reverse, back up lights.

    EOH has nothing to do with it.

    As far as why only one caliper locks up I would suspect that that particular caliper has less air trapped in it than the others as most calipers mount in a way that makes them almost impossible to get all the air out of them unless you remove the caliper and hold it in a way that keeps the bleeder port at the very highest point of the cylinder bore.

    If you have ever had a disc brake caliper apart you can see that the bleed port is not always at the high point of the caliper once it's mounted on the axle bracket.

    Back to the original problem, if the trailer wiring has a five wire connector at the trailer plug and the truck harness only has a four wire connector, fix this before going any further, you will more than likely be happy with the results.

    One last thing, the OP says he bought this trailer only four months ago.

    Assuming you picked it up at their business, they should have made you aware you had a wiring issue that needed to be corrected to have the trailer perform as expected, VERY bad on them, you might want to give the owner a call and let him/her know about the poor service he got when he spent his hard earned money at their business.

    WD.
     
  20. WaveDancer

    WaveDancer Fishing The Pacific Ocean & Puget Sound Since 1969

    Location:
    Kitsap/Westport, WA
    Name:
    Ken
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    You said you have a five wire connector but didn't say if it's on the truck or trailer side, or both.

    WD.
     

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