Black Hole CB 801MH or 801H?

Discussion in 'Jigging and Popping' started by BiggetyBones, Jan 6, 2019.

  1. BiggetyBones

    BiggetyBones MiggetyMac

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    Jamie / Kilsong / or anyone else with Black Hole Challenger 801 insight, I’m hoping you can help me decide which rod to purchase.

    Looking to purchase my first popping rod. Was initially looking at the Phenix Titan Line, but after hours of searches, I’m now leaning towards a Black Hole Challenger Bank 801. I’m looking to fish the following poppers:

    - Halco Roosta 160 - 75g (2.65oz)
    - Halco Roosta Haymaker - 117g (4.13oz)
    - Heru Skipjack - 60g, 90g,120g (2.12oz, 3.17oz, 4.23oz)
    - Heru Tuna 80g, 100g (2.82oz, 3.52oz)

    I’m primarily fishing So Cal, but will also head to Mexico if the tuna run down that way. Trips will range from 1.5 - 3 day trips. Like all of us, hope the cows come back again this year either locally or at Catalina / SCI.

    With this said, I don’t know whether or not I should go with the Black Hole Challenger Bank 801MH or 801H.?.?.?.?

    For those of you who have have the CB 801H, how well does it throw the lighter poppers, specifically Halco Roosta 160 (2.65oz)?

    The BH CB 801MH is rated for lures from 3 - 6 ounces.
    The BH CB 801H is rated for lures from 4 - 10 ounces).
    http://www.blackholeusa.com/challenger-bank-rods--blanks.html

    I like the idea of having the heavier rod (801H) if in case I hook a larger fish, but I think more importantly I want the right rod that will effectively / successfully launch the poppers I’ve mentioned above.

    Any and all info is much appreciated!
     
  2. Russ Scholl

    Russ Scholl Newbie

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    Jamie has given an absolute treatise on the CB and Nano and graphite BH poppers.-For which I am so grateful! Search it. You may find that the 8’ Nano is the best choice for what you have described.-Good luck.
     
  3. MAG0121

    MAG0121 Well-Known "Member"

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    I fish the CB 801H (built up with a trigger grip) with a Lexa 400HD, 65lb braid to heavy flouro leaders crimped to my poppers. No problem at all launching the Halco Roosta 160 and 195. The added rod stiffness helps to get a solid pop and I’ve never felt overgunned on even the schoolies that I’ve had on it. I’ve heard of this blank handling triple digit fish, but honestly it’s sweet spot is in the 40-50lb fish range. Actually really like it as a YT yo-yo setup as well.
     
  4. hucklongfin

    hucklongfin Deep release specialist

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    I've caught a lot of fish throwing Halco 160's on the BH CB S-801H. I've thrown several sizes of Skipjacks and Heru Tuna 100's too. It's done well with all of them!
     
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  5. BiggetyBones

    BiggetyBones MiggetyMac

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    Appreciate the comments so far, Thank you and please keep them coming.

    Has anybody fished the Black Hole Challenger Bank 801 MH? Would love to hear from you!

    I forgot to mention a few important details. I want the Black Hole CB rod to be a spinning rod for fishing on cattle boats. 99% of the time I fish cattle boats and most of my rods are Phenix 9'ers. I personally like fishing the long rods on the cattle boats as its a lil easier to do the over / under dance and around the anchor loop de loop. I also like the additional length as it provides better distance when casting.

    The reality for me is, I won't fish the big hogs with this stick. If the cows do show up, I'll quickly put this rod in the rack and fish a flat fall on my Phenix Axis X3H / Talica 25 for them. And if I'm being honest with myself, I don't get to see too many cows. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see/fish for cows, but unless I get lucky on a 1.5 - 3 day trip, this rod will be for tuna less than 100 lbs.

    I have other rods for yoyo or surface irons so this rod will strictly be used for throwing poppers and nothing else.

    My main concern with the 801H was the lure weight rating that it has of 4-10 oz. Since the MH is rated 3-6 oz, I initially thought this was the rod for me as the poppers I plan on throwing are in the 60g - 120g (2.12oz - 4.23oz) range. Although most of the searches on this rod, It appears most everyone has the 801H. Just wish I could hear from someone who's fished the 801 MH.

    So far from your responses, it sounds like the 801H will cast the lighter poppers just fine.

    So I guess now I'm leaning towards the 801H. Now I need a reel for it.

    In one of the threads, someone asked Kilsong what reel size would best fit the 801H and his answer was a 10000 size reel.

    hucklongfin, i think you originally had a saragosa 10000 on a Black Hole CB 801H. I believe in one of your posts, you said you'll be swapping out the Saragosa 10000 with a Twin Power 14000. Is the 14000 size reel a better fit?

    Please keep your replies coming! Thank you again for your knowledge!
     
  6. hucklongfin

    hucklongfin Deep release specialist

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    I use both the SRG10K and TP14K on it. The 14k isn't much larger than the 10k so they feel the same in action. On my last trip I used the 14k for poppers.
     
  7. Exodus

    Exodus Member

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    I also have a Black Hole CB 801H, with a Saragosa 8000SW. This set-up is pretty well balanced for my liking. I currently have 60# Threadlock on the spool. I ended up with this set-up, after the same research you are doing. The Halco Roosta 160 casts just fine and can imagine the Heru will cast even better. Sadly, I haven't had a solid hook-up on it yet. Dodo's only wanted the mini macs for my times on the water this past year and never saw a YFT.
     
  8. fishordie

    fishordie I've posted enough I should edit this section

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    Good afternoon BBS.,

    It has been a pleasure communicating with you by PM... Here is my opinion on the MH vs. the H version of the Blackhole Challenger 801 spinner... The MH is a great rod for throwing somewhat lighter artificial lures but for west coast, heavy platform work (Meaning not from a light and easily maneuverable boat) The H version is going to meet a larger range of West Coast, Commercial Sport fishing boat, requirements for bigger yellowtail and up to medium sized tuna.. The power of the H is significantly greater than the MH when it comes to both throwing slightly larger lures and then fighting the fish. Fighting fish with artificial lures is not like fishing smaller hooks with live bait... The Angler should always keep max pressure when fighting the fish, using less pumping and winding as that will ultimately put more slack into the line especially when using a softer flexing, parabolic rod. Learning bigger fish landing techniques is going to be paramount to getting the most out of the rod. However, if you have sone extra change in your pocket, I would absolutely also look into a bit more rod in the Blackhole Cape Cod Popping 86 Nano (My Favorite rod for the applications you have noted but costs another 100 - 150 dollars). Matched to a Shimano 14K Twin Power And you have a serious rig on your hands.. No doubt the Challenger series are awesome rods but I would definitely consider stepping up the rod. There are a number of other options from Penn, Shimano and Cabo as well depending on how the rig feels to you as well as how deep your pocketbook is..

    In actuality, most anglers are not going to throw a 60 G Popper or stick bait 100 yds.. with the non surf casting rods we are discussing. I would say, for most anglers, anything over 70 yds will be a job very well done. Casting an artificial into the wind will result in less distance regardless how good you are. Developing a more efficient casting style by practicing correct technique is going to be a requirement.. However, the learning curve is so much easier and faster using a spinner once a knowledgeable person gives some one on one help with your casting style.

    Many folks believe that the rod is going to bend super deep when casting.. No doubt, when watching surf casters with 15 foot, lighter action rods, you do see a deep flex when as a good angler loads the rod.. But our tradeoff for angling from a Commercial Sport boat platform, where fellow anglers/crew and parts of the boat impede our ability to use such long tools, is we use a more compact length rod. The other trade off is we are using heavier lines and higher drag pressures, at least when this type of fishing is done efficiently.

    As far as the reel goes, contrary to some, the reel is going to do one heck of a lot of work. Just because a reel claims to be rated for the task does not mean it actually is. Therefore a proper reel, that can handle higher drags in real life fishing situations is going to be important. Luckily, we have so many manufacturers and line items that will fit this bill however the cost of most is going to easily set you back a minimum of 300 dollars. Shimano Saragossa 10K, Twin Power 10k and 14K, Cabo 100, Penn Slammer 3 and a few others will be great. No doubt the Stella's are amazing but now we are getting really up there in dinero.

    Anyway, feel free to PM me with any more question or feel free to contact me by phone..

    Hope you have a great season and best of luck with your choices...

    Jamie
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2019
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  9. hucklongfin

    hucklongfin Deep release specialist

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    I use the following for poppers and stick baits
    Major Craft 77 Hiramasa with a Saragosa 6000
    Black Hole Challenger Bank S-801H with a Saragosa 10000
    Black Hole Cape Cod Special 86n with a Twin Power 14000
    Black Hole Cape Cod Special 80g with a Makaira 20000

    I’ve had 10 day trips where I was the only one throwing poppers until a couple others tied poppers on their bait rigs after they saw how well I was doing... and how much fun!
     
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  10. BiggetyBones

    BiggetyBones MiggetyMac

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    Jamie, that's exactly what I needed to know . I really appreciate you taking the time to share your insight! Was really hoping you would. Weekends are tough for me so being able to visit you Saturday is almost impossible. I'm going to send you a PM.

    Mark, thank you also for sharing your insight / gear. I remembered you specifically when I was searching through the archives because you are in Mission. I'm in Aliso.

    Russ, thanks for the tip!

    Would love to share the rail with you guys one day!

    Sounds like I'm going to need to save my pennies for a Blackhole Cape Cod Popping 86 Nano!
     
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  11. scott v

    scott v Well-Known "Member"

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    I have the cb 761mh. I know you are asking about the 8 foot and maybe that has more back bone. I made the mistake of fishing 30lb and hooking an 80lb class bluefin. Fish came to the boat but I got my butt handed to me. Obviously 30lb was the wrong choice, regardless I would of loved to of had the H in my hands.
     
  12. nmthree

    nmthree Nick M- So Cal

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    I have this same set up with a 14k. Beast of a setup and very versatile for poppers and stickbaits
     
  13. Russ Scholl

    Russ Scholl Newbie

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    There you go-a 2 piece rod will travel to Mexico better as well if you are flying.
     
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  14. hucklongfin

    hucklongfin Deep release specialist

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    Come on over if you want to check out my popping sticks!
     
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  15. Russ Scholl

    Russ Scholl Newbie

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    Treaties part 2-love it-Thanks!
     
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  16. BiggetyBones

    BiggetyBones MiggetyMac

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    That’s very kind of you, thank you the invite Mark! Question for you.... you have both the Black Hole Challenger Bank S-801H, as well as the Black Hole Cape Cod Special 86n. If you could have only one of those setups for popping, which setup would you choose?

    Next week I’m going to make the drive up to Bob Sands to check out what they got and chat with Jamie a little more about the rods, reels, and popping in general.

    I’m leaning heavily towards the Black Hole 8’6 Cape Code Special Nano.

    I’ve been researching the various saltwater reel manufacturers on the market. I’ve always been a fan of Shimano as their customer service has always been excellent. Not to mention they are local to us here in Orange County.

    Although I have read some negative things about the Shimano Twin Power SW 140000, I’ve also read many positive things. I feel like I’m leaning towards pairing the rod with this reel.

    So much to consider, so much to buy! Will just have to save my pennies and purchase in stages.

    Thanks again for all your replies!
     
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  17. hucklongfin

    hucklongfin Deep release specialist

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    I'd probably go with the 86n if I could just have one but that wouldn't be as much fun! I do like the TP 14k over the SRG 10k for popping. You don't have to crank as fast with the TP to get caught up with the popper. I do hate having to pay all the extra for the TP over the SRG just for that extra 13" per crank.
     
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  18. Russ Scholl

    Russ Scholl Newbie

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    Better drag too.
     
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  19. hucklongfin

    hucklongfin Deep release specialist

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    Yes, but I don't find that the 55# of the TP is really any more useful than the 33# of the SRG since I've never used that much drag on either one. But I'd bet that the TP would do better with 30# of drag than the SRG. Most reels don't perform well when set to max. I haven't needed the 66# that the Mak 20k is rated for either!
     
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  20. Russ Scholl

    Russ Scholl Newbie

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    Agree
     

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