Attaching Shimano Flat Fall Jig

johndtuttle

Angler/Client
Mar 20, 2008
5,574
1,752
Carmel, CA
Name
john
Boat
not crazy enough yet
I see how the jig is set up , but, what size split ring, solid ring and swivel are you using?

Owner Hyper Wire split ring, I want to say #8 and around 150 lb rated? I always throw out the packages as they take up too much space in my box. They have to be heavy as they do fatigue over time opening them to change jigs with the pliers. You WILL need split ring pliers for these. You need even heavier if jigging for Cows.

SPRO swivels rated 500#

Assist cord is 500#

Hook should be slightly wider than jig, in a general sense.

All of this is extra heavy for multiple use on many fish.


best
 

johndtuttle

Angler/Client
Mar 20, 2008
5,574
1,752
Carmel, CA
Name
john
Boat
not crazy enough yet
Thanks John al I need is the 500lb swivel, I got 330lb. Can't buy right now since I'm on the Excel 9 day.
Get some fish and let us know how you do!
 

Steve K

Hey, I'm gettin' bit...
Jan 2, 2005
11,219
6,621
Bishop
Name
Steve
Boat
18' Bayrunner, but I like the American Angler and the Red Rooster III
This is at the tail end of 4 pages and 70 replies on a thread on the Long Range Forum. Thought I'd repost this over here with this crowd. Appreciate the feedback.
fished.jpe


Sure glad we are having this discussion. So much good information and opinions being shared for the benefit of us all. Let's face it, we all are constantly striving to build a better mouse trap. How can we better defeat that big tuna? We use so many different methods to fish for them. Acknowledging that tuna don't spend the majority of their time swimming around on the surface, chasing down Sardines.

I received the jigs I ordered, the knock off Fall Flat jigs, 250 gram. Following are some pictures of them as rigged from the manufacturer and with an optional rigging method I'm working on. The way they are rigged in the package is probably OK for fishing smaller fish in the smaller sizes. I'm sure these hooks would be fine for Yellows in the smaller sizes, 80-100 gram. But, the hooks are not tried or tested as far as I know, for these bigger fish we'll be targeting down in the lower zone. The three painted jigs in Sardine and Phantom Squid patterns will be used in the daytime and the glow patterns will be tested in the dark.

The thread they have used to rig up the double hook assist rig is not very substantial, more like nylon string than heavy duty Kevlar. You get what you pay for, and maybe the rigging on the Shimano Flat Fall is more substantial, but had no intention of using the two hook rigging when I ordered.I took those off and kept the hooks, (6/0 J hook) probably for Yellows on a dropper loop.

For the rig I just tied up, first thought, I used some 300 lb Momoi High Catch Mono, crimped on one end to a ring and grommet and on the other to a ringed 8/0 Super Mutu Hook. This can be lengthened or shortened. Ring of the Ring and Grommet is connected to the jig with a split ring. First pic is with the hook alongside the jig the way it will lay on the retrieve. I'll tie or crimp onto the ring of the Ring and Grommet, probably with 150 lb or heavier mono. I suppose another option is to crimp to the bottom ring of a swivel and tie or crimp to the bottom ring, attaching the bottom ring to the jig with the split ring.
 

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Steve K

Hey, I'm gettin' bit...
Jan 2, 2005
11,219
6,621
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Name
Steve
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18' Bayrunner, but I like the American Angler and the Red Rooster III
Thanks John al I need is the 500lb swivel, I got 330lb. Can't buy right now since I'm on the Excel 9 day.
Kim, hope you got your share. I see ProFishCo Ball Bearing Swivels with Grommets for not much money. Like 300 lb rated: 4 swivels with grommets on both ends and 8 ring and grommets. Delrin grommets.
Has anybody used these, and for fishing these bigger tuna, is a 300 lb swivel adequate or does a guy need the 450-550 lb rated ones? Price not really the issue, but like 8 bucks for the two pack of 300 lb 2 swivels and 4 ring and grommet, and same price for the two pack of 450-550 lb 1 swivel and 2 ring and grommet.
 

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Steve K

Hey, I'm gettin' bit...
Jan 2, 2005
11,219
6,621
Bishop
Name
Steve
Boat
18' Bayrunner, but I like the American Angler and the Red Rooster III
Evolving rigging. I took a different look at that first setup and decided to give it another go. Same idea, just 200 lb mono instead of 300 lb. Big difference is the size of my crimps, the 300 lb crimps being about twice the length of the ones I use to crimp 200 lb. Should lend itself to sliding better through the fish's mouth to the corner. I used a different hook on this one as well, the more traditional J hook, this one is from the two hook assist rig that came with the jig.
rig.jpe
 
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bluewaterbum

I've posted enough I should edit this section
Jul 16, 2012
1,069
285
Riverside, Ca
Name
Kim
Boat
none
Well John, the trip was tough in more ways then one. Tuna and Wahoo didn't want to play at all during the trip. Only a couple of tuna were caught by bait, the rest were on the kite. I did have a 50 to 60 pounder on a glow in the dark flat fall, which was gaffed but it was still green and threw both the gaff and the jig at the same time. Deckhand tried to regaff the fish but didn't take his time and missed four time while the fish was right in front of him. All I could do to keep from saying anything in anger was say shit happens and go back to fishing.

I did catch every trash fish around on a flat sided jig and flat falls. This included about 25 skipjacks small to fat suckers. I now know that a family member wants skipjack for pokie.

Yellowtail fishing was tough also when it came to better grade of fish with many in the 10 to 15 pound range. I did end up with 11 over a couple of days, but they were caught on a 6x salas jig.

Weather was the biggest factor with high winds and seas (7 to 15 foot winds 15 to 30 knots)for 7 of the 9 days of the trip. We also had a uphill current when we did anchor.

The above said I'll still be fishing vertical jigs more the bait.
 

Paparockcal

Old Dude
May 22, 2016
296
123
Whites Canyon Rd., Canyon Country
Name
Rocky Latham
Boat
N/A Now But I had a 21ft Gulf Coast when I lived on the mainland near Galveston, Texas
Could someone explain the running the line through both eyes of the jig and then tying the hook to the line method? Pros and Cons.
 

afraser

I've posted enough I should edit this section
Apr 20, 2008
1,699
1,256
sf, ca
Name
aaron
Boat
NA
Could someone explain the running the line through both eyes of the jig and then tying the hook to the line method? Pros and Cons.
pros: the fish can't use the lure as leverage
Cons: no bite leader, lower hook to land rate

Best way to maximize fish landed is to use a short bridle circle hook. 80% hook to land rate in fish over 100# assuming you are using 100lb line.

IMG_4483.JPG
 
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DennisV

I've posted enough I should edit this section
Jan 4, 2017
863
1,325
62
Paloma, CA
Name
Dennis Vagt
Boat
Just a NuCanoe Frontier now.
Aaron, have you been bit on the retrieve and did it stick ?
 

afraser

I've posted enough I should edit this section
Apr 20, 2008
1,699
1,256
sf, ca
Name
aaron
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NA
Aaron, have you been bit on the retrieve and did it stick ?
Not bit on the retrieve. As I said, 95% of the bites are on the sink or jigging, so I'm not worried about the retrieve. The tuna swim 30+ mph, I can't reel that fast, so they are going to swallow the lure. If they don't get the hook, they won't feel it either, like they might with a j hook, so they will likely come back for another bite.
 

Diverduane

Newbie
Jan 1, 2019
13
1
Antioch, Ca
Name
Duanne Shoemake
Boat
Ranger 521 Seaswirl 2300 250 Yamaha
I have a question on what lb test Hollow core spectra to put on a Shimano Spheros 10000 spinning reel for poppers. Is 40# too light? I'm thinking of line capacity and possibly more casting distance.
 

ripped

I've posted enough I should edit this section
Dec 5, 2007
2,054
1,874
Santa Barbara
Name
Gary
Boat
Vagabond
I have a question on what lb test Hollow core spectra to put on a Shimano Spheros 10000 spinning reel for poppers. Is 40# too light? I'm thinking of line capacity and possibly more casting distance.
Wrong thread
 

fasteddie2

Well-Known "Member"
Feb 28, 2013
53
3
ontario
Name
ed
Boat
tiburon
Think of the flat fall jig as a boat, or a submarine gliding horizontally, your line is attached on the front and your hooks must be on the front too, assist monster hooks, to a solid ring, line with Palomar knot, a split ring on the solid ring for the jig no hooks on the jig, nothing on the back of the jig. Naked, It must glide naked, That's the best set up for best action for that jig style. Lube the jig with fresh squid gel. 😉
 

Blind Luck

I've posted enough I should edit this section
Feb 14, 2015
154
293
Name
Mike Grieco
Boat
MALAKAS
Can any of you post how you rig "figure 8" rings on jigs?
 

Jakiedog

Well-Known "Member"
Jul 31, 2008
63
101
Oregon
Name
Ron
Boat
16 " Duckworth
16024301644123287907339457763822.jpg
Here you go. Picture of the "figure 8". I don't want to rely on split rings for anything. This method bypasses the split ring when fighting a fish, it solely holds the jig. The hook is attached via #600 hollow core kevlar. I catch a lot of tuna on jigs, this is the only setup I use.
 

rubberneck-man

North east fishing.....
Sep 22, 2017
10
1
ny
Name
john smith
Boat
my missy
I found these for tying flat falls, slow pitch jigs and butterfly jigs. The call them Quick sea bouy pro grade rigging swivels.
They have a welded ring that you tie your assist hook onto. Then you use a split ring to attach the jig onto. The thing about these are since they swivels they help prevent line twist.

5B9C97E0-D0D7-4F2D-AF10-83FB7CED9809.jpeg
 

rubberneck-man

North east fishing.....
Sep 22, 2017
10
1
ny
Name
john smith
Boat
my missy
Oops. Quick rig sea bouy swivels is the correct name. Tomo’s tackle also sells similar welded ring swivels from owner. The packaging appear to be a JDM product.
 

Thurmanator

Breathe through your nose
Aug 30, 2014
25
7
42
Name
Aaron
Boat
Someday
Oops. Quick rig sea bouy swivels is the correct name. Tomo’s tackle also sells similar welded ring swivels from owner. The packaging appear to be a JDM product.
Why the extra solid ring on the swivel, concerns over the split ring wearing on the assist cord?

I use S pro 500lb swivels with the owner ultra split ring and assist hook attached to the swivel.

New to this rigging so trying to filter through all the info for the “best “ setup is mind numbing after a while.
 

rubberneck-man

North east fishing.....
Sep 22, 2017
10
1
ny
Name
john smith
Boat
my missy
The reason for it is: with the sea bouy double-welded ring as previously mentioned - the assist hook(s) are on a welded ring that's intertwined with another welded ring, with a split ring that contains the jig. In other words....the *weak* point is the split ring with the jig..not the hooks. I use the term *weak* loosely...in only the sense that given a split ring with a diameter of "A", and a solid/welded ring with the same diameter of "A" - the solid/welded ring will always be much stronger (at least that's what I've found...perhaps there are exceptions...if there are - please post the exceptions). Obviously you can scale up your split rings or buy better ones...and your mileage may vary depending on the quality of split rings you use.

An ASCII drawing would be something like this:

leader --> sea bouy swivel --> welded-ring --> split ring --> jig
|
|
|
second welded ring
|
assist hooks

The alternative scenario would be the "typical" scenario or "regular" scenario is not using those double-welded ring swivels and just using a regular barrel swivel is this:


leader ---> barrel swivel --> split ring --> solid ring (that has assist hooks)
|
|
jig

I've lost several two vertical jigs that broke or popped off with a YFT on....but the fish was still hooked and landed. it was just hooked/landed without a jig...it was rigged up using the sea buoy swivels.....would I have lost a jig + a fish? I don't know....maybe. I'd rather loose a jig, than loose a 60lbs YFT. That's me though....really I don't want to loose any jigs....and for the record - I do tie up my vertical jigs both ways as previously described...with success. I was just saying...that I like using those sea buoy swivels....when I have them. I like them as an option in my tackle box.

For some reason...I find the YFT in the north east US, the YFT prefer smaller jigs...small profile jigs...say 130gr - 168gr...3.5-5 inch in length (yes there are always exceptions). YFT tuna size maybe 30lbs-100lbs or so YFT...seem to really like that size jig....and I've seen scenarios and been there where big YFT wanted small jigs, 60lbs or less leader and the fish were down deep - 150ft or deeper. It kinda leaves you scratching your head.....that you need something low profile...and strong as well to get these fish in...hence....the second welded ring.