How undersized is this tackle???

Discussion in 'San Diego Long Range Fishing' started by strackle99, Nov 12, 2010.

  1. strackle99
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    I have two Avet 30 EXWs, and one HX Raptor. How undersized are these for cows?

    I was thinking of a short topshot of 100 lb on the raptor and an EXW, and putting an 80 lb topshot on the other EXW.

    I would rather spend the cash on a trip now, than buy two more setups and wait for next year.

    Any advice is appreciated.
  2. saltwaterfish
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    hw raptor will work fine. I think a 300+ lb cow was caught by a raptor last year. plenty of 200 lb have and will be caught on the hx raptor
  3. Derf284
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    Dont know what boat your going on but call them and get a loaner.

    Not that you need to go out and buy a new set up, and I am sure I am going to get flack for saying this but you will have more "power" if you will, killing a cow with a 50 then you will with a 30. I have gotten cows on both and with a 70 penn not really easy to handle all day but great for killing.

    If you were going to pull a boat up a hill what would you want a mini truck or a semi. Ok I said it and all the trolls are going to come out I am sure but its the truth.
    Nothing wrong with the 30 size reel I got 2 and love them. Good luck and post pics when you get back.
  4. Sactotuna
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    This is just my personal opinion!
    How undersized? Desperately.
    Wayyyy too little line capacity.
    Yes, some guy caught one once, etc etc etc blah blah blah. Some guy also caught a blue marlin on a flyrod with a 4# tippet. Doesn't mean it's adequate for routine use and certainly not optimal.
    Contact the boat for a couple of their rigs, or borrow from someone you know.
    The chance of a lifetime may come only once, don't blow it.
  5. saltwaterfish
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    Actually, I have seen and caught several cows on the hw raptors. I think I got about 550 yards of 100 solid spectra on mine. To compare - I have a 50 reel that only took 600 yards of 130 hollow... not too much difference. either reel may get spooled - and you may need to throw in a back up no matter which you have - right?
  6. harddrive
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    Avet 30 EXW is enough for the cows. Put on some 100lbs Fluoro and you'll be ok. I'd prefer a 50 size reel. But you won't have too much problems with the EXW.
  7. bob1825
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    call the boat and ask for loaner set ups, they want you to spend your money on a trip just as much as you do! :) Many times, the loaner outfits are free and they only charge for the top shots. Don't let your tackle determine if you can take a trip. Good luck!
  8. Steve K
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    Call the boat. Get one or two 50 size reels.
  9. afraser
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    You are totally fine. I assume you have 100# line on all 3? Fill up with JB 100 (thinner than the JB 80) breaks at 120#+. Should get 850 yds on an avet 30w (I have 750 yds plus 100 yds of JB 130 on top). Way more than you will use unless you like fishing 15# of drag. Wish I had an HX raptor for my trip. It is fine for the sub 250 cows. Bigger than that, well, you takes your chances. Better hope you don't get a demon fish. So 2.5 rigs for cows? Plenty. You don't need a loaner, but they are free, so why not have a 4th rod just in case.
  10. strackle99
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    I have 130 lb on the EXWs, and 100 lb on the raptor. Had them filled at Squidco, so I Don't know the exact capacity.
  11. charles v. West
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    The first trip I went on I got one 196 on the boats kite gear. That thing nearly got all the line off of an 80, I thought it was a submarine . There's exceptions to every circumstance. Be prepared, not sorry. Seems cows on crack this year.
  12. DV4701
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    Your 30 EXW hold 500 yrds of #130, the same as my T-Rx. My HXW Raptor holds 700 of #100, so 550 yrds on the standard. IMO, stay away from the #80, I plan to fish #130 early morning/late afternoon and #100 during the slow afternoon.

    Good Luck and Good Fishing
  13. fishbone24
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    fill all the 30's up with 100 hollow - 1 for 100, the other for 130
    (flouro), use the raptor for 80 (on top of 100 hollow),(sometimes this is all that will get bit in the mid day doldrum?) - i have a 50 and it usually stays in the rack unless i toss out a chunk or if it blows wde open. i guess you could borrow one from the boat as a backup 130 for these purposes.
  14. Garabaldi
    Offline

    X2

    You would think we were fishing for 500lb Broadbill's or grander Black's they way some of these guys here on the BD Long Range forum talk. Standard 30 size reels have been the go to reels for LR anglers in the know for cow fishing for over 5 years now! Many cows and numerous super cows have been landed on standard 30 size lever drag, big game reels. The standard 30's have plenty of line capacity when you step up hollow Spectra from 100lb to 30 yards of 130lb to 20 yards of 200lb (if needed) to your leader which can be 100lb to 130lb fluoro or mono depending on the application at hand. The 30's cast MUCH better than the 50's do and when the 30's have been modified to have the same low gear ratio as the 50's, they actually have MORE torque at the crank than a 50 does cuz your are turning a smaller diameter spool. And of course a 30 is MUCH more FUN to fish with than a heavy, bulky 50 when at the rail for hours at a time.

    The only application for a 50 since the advent of Spectra IMO is for the kite where you may have a 100+ yards of line out before you even get bit and the larger diameter spool can retieve line faster when that larger grade fish runs straight at you at high speed, and you need to pick up slack line muy pronto.

    The only downside to fishing the smaller reels like the HX Raptor, Penn 16 VSX, ATD 12, Makaira 20, Tib SST 20 is when the jumbo super cows are in the mix, cuz then you may have line capacity issues but not neccessarily equipment failure cuz the newer, high quality smaller two speed reels can take the heat and pressure. But as "fishbone24" says... sometimes you need a "finesse" 80lb leader outfit to get bit during the high noon slow time of the day ("pick" bite) or when the fish are mostly in the lower 200's and they are a little boat shy so you need to get your bait out further and have it be more lively on the lighter string.

    My personal cow arsenal is made up of three (30) outfits, two (20) outfits, one (16) outfit, one (50) big bait/chunk/kite outfit, and YES you guessed it... zero (spin) outfits [​IMG]

    Tight lines!
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2010
  15. Bill W
    Online

    Gear ratio and size of gears favor bigger reels. Drags fade when the heat is not dissipated. (through the frame mass) I have seen some big fish caught on Accurate ATD-30 reels, top of the line stuff. I have caught a handful of cows on my Avet 20 but once you go over 250lbs it's a different animal.

    One thing on your side is deep water tuna tend to stick around the boat. Do you really want to hook a #300 tuna on your Raptor?
  16. Garabaldi
    Offline


    Not my preferred choice for sure! I fish the Tib SST 20 instead of the HX Raptor reel because it casts better and has a large carbontex drag washer, as well as a big, thick, super strong stainless helical cut low gear so in my mind I have a real decent shot at landing a mid to upper 200lb class cow if the opportunity presents itself. One of my fishing buddies landed a 240lb cow on my SST 20 reel in PV three weeks ago in less than 45 minutes from a stationary boat.

    IMO, for super's you truly want a really good 30 (ATD 30 or Tib SST 30 are my choices) or maybe even a 50 if you are banging with mean, green upper 300lb cows. But we all know there are times in LR (a lot of them) when supers just are not in the mix, and it takes more of a "finesse" oufit (80lb leader) to get bit well or at all... so do you chance it and go lighter?... or just sit there and play it super safe with your heavy string, heavy rod and bulky 50 reel and get nothing more than a nice sun tan out of your rail time (personally I'll take the chance with the higher quality slightly lighter gear knowing that with proper technique and a bit of luck I can pull it off if I do just happen to hang that lone freak larger grade cow swimming with the runts).

    Kinda like that hot girl in high school... you can play it real safe and never ask her out for fear of failure or you can go for it, hopefully get some action, and then see what happens from there (by the way, I've seen a lot of real ugly dudes with mighty fine looking chicks in my lifetime, so I say what the hell, why not go for it if it gets you in the game, as my tough as nails, one time boxing champ grandfather would say... "no guts - no glory" [​IMG])

    Tight lines!
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2010
  17. stairman
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    Which ever reel you fish get your ass out of bed in the morning and then out of the galley and start fishing while they drift at night.
    Those fish on the lower banks are on squid red crabs and other baits.Have a squid 150 yards from the boat at grey light.If a school swims by the boat they will think your squid is lolly gagging getting back to the safety of the depths which is the way little squid get to be big squid some day.Get a cow in the morning and the breakfast can wait.....you can get great food on shore .....there are no cows at dennys.
    In the evening be the guy that is the last to reel in when they make the move for the night.....if your fishing a dean or mac reel it in at the speed a hot lively bait takes it out and no faster.There are a lot of fish(cows and super cows hooked in the last fifteen minutes of light in the sky....they will wait to serve you dinner.....you can't catch a cow or super cow at the corner steak house on shore.
    You'll have two days to catch up on sleep on the way home.

    Then you can laugh when they grumble that that damn fish hog is holding up the boat with another cow! The best way to end a trip is when you hook one on the last day and the guys who sat in the galley for before dinner cocktails or breakfast say"does that asshole have ANOTHER FISH"!
    Fish hard and sleep at home.It won't kill you...you will kill fish.
    PS a 30 wide two speed will kill a cow just fine....a narrow 30 is like hunting grizzlies with a 30.06....it will do the job sometimes
    A 50 or fifty wide is insurance if you hook a super cow....if you're man enough to fish it all day.You 'll be able to turn the handle in low with a 50 much better...others advice here is good ...some is dead wrong.
  18. strackle99
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    Do I want to hook a #300 tuna on my raptor?

    Do I want to spend a year wondering if I should have gone?

    It is better to go this year, with the tackle I have, than buy two 50Ws, and keep them in the closet till next year.

    If I get spooled on the gear I have, I will still fish next year, with bigger tackle.

    I am not exactly bringing a knife to a gunfight. I am fucking going. Not sure what boat yet. I will be the guy with the two green EXWs, and the silver raptor.
  19. Bill W
    Online

    So Todd,
    It comes down ultimately to putting pressure on the fish. How hard can you crank and how smooth and fast you can get the job done.

    Ie: it's all about technique...

    For if that is not down, it's going to take a while... And the longer it takes the less chance you have. Most guys do not put enough pressure on the fish. Some tackle when the drags are heating up back off. Accurate reels that does not happen. I love Avets but it would not be right for me to say I have not seen drag fade on a 50SDS with big fish...

    Whatever you set your drags at strike to, I prefer to do a straight pull to test. It's just a referance and once you get that factor dialed in it's a start. If you get in trouble, point your rod at the fish. The rail is my friend. Just fish them like big albacore. Rail fishing brings over the same mindset, smooth short pump. And the big one is always use the swells. Know how much pressure you can put on your rod without line coming off your reel. If the big one does a kick, go with it with your rod tip.
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2010
  20. Steve K
    Offline

    "I am not exactly bringing a knife to a gunfight. I am fucking going. Not sure what boat yet. I will be the guy with the two green EXWs, and the silver raptor."

    Nothing wrong with using what you have. Sounds like you may have had your mind all made up before coming to the forum and asking the question: "How undersized is this tackle?" I myself have a new AVET PRO EXW30/2 just like you. (Well, except that mine's purple);) And I plan on bringing it on my trip in January. I'm only bringing six reels for big fish, three are 30 sized (Penn 30S, Avet 30W, and a borrowed ATD30. The others are 50 size. Just be aware that those giving advice here, certainly including myself, don't have nearly the experience on big fish that any of the captains or most of the crew members do.

    Just have an open mind, sort through the good advice and make your game plan. I would, however, when you call the office to book your trip, ask to talk to the captain about gear. Chances are pretty good that when you describe what you have, he'll tell you to get your hands on a 50 sized reel and a rod with enough balls that won't bottom out when you're lifting the fish, whether that's an outfit that you are able to borrow from a friend or from the boat. Get back to us after that conversation and let us know how it went.

    Now, go book a trip; those fish are a bitin'

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